How can comprobe if LRL rods works

[hung]

Originally Posted by Esteban

Of course, you'll mantain some attitude and have practice with it. I see a man who almost never fails and the method is some complex, but is between 2 persons. Also I found with it, but don't know why... but better is inside a motor wich produce some vibrations in hand, this help very much.

You can use LEDs also.
I beieve Knouzm dowsing devices all have LEDs.

[Esteban]

Originally Posted by hung

You can use LEDs also.
I beieve Knouzm dowsing devices all have LEDs.

No, vibration is for muscle, leds no.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Geo

So the copper that i found is a product from the unconscious mind ??
Coins that i have found are a product from the unconscious mind ????
The only that i know is that i take the L Rods and i find coins etc. I have found more coins with the rods than with metal detectors.
I have not problem if the coins that i found are from dowsing method or from unconscious mind. Please find a method so the unconscious mind to help us for finding coins treasures etc without the need of metal detectors.

If you want to use rods, guessing, or whatever to find treasure ... and it seems to be working for you ... then use it.

But. if you want to understand what's really happening, perform a double-blind test. Of course, if you're like Hung, you can continue with your head in the sand and refuse to know the sad truth.

Whatever you decide, it's up to you.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by hung

You can use LEDs also.
I beieve Knouzm dowsing devices all have LEDs.

http://knouzm.net/content/view/333/98/lang,en/

Hmmm ... this looks like some familiar wallet-mining.

[Max]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

http://knouzm.net/content/view/333/98/lang,en/

Hmmm ... this looks like some familiar wallet-mining.

new label... KM5000!

What an effort I say....

What to expect from people that love carnival ?

Just new mask for same stuff..

Kind regads,
Max

[Geo]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

If you want to use rods, guessing, or whatever to find treasure ... and it seems to be working for you ... then use it.

But. if you want to understand what's really happening, perform a double-blind test. Of course, if you're like Hung, you can continue with your head in the sand and refuse to know the sad truth.

Whatever you decide, it's up to you.

I believe that you did not understand what I mean. With the rods, i and a lot of other we find easily, difference burried objects. Most of them are rust objects. I do not believe where rods indicate to me, and I find some object, that all they are accidental. For this I would want is even studied this phenomenon, for the rusting objects.
If the science still do not discover, with who way it functions Dowsing, it not means that it is not in effect Dowsing. And naturally, we did not deal with this ??????

[Geo]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

If you want to use rods, guessing, or whatever to find treasure ... and it seems to be working for you ... then use it.

But. if you want to understand what's really happening, perform a double-blind test. Of course, if you're like Hung, you can continue with your head in the sand and refuse to know the sad truth.

Whatever you decide, it's up to you.

Yesterday i located with rods a place at my farm. I took my DP and i checked it. Really was a object . I dig it and i found a rust bolt.
How L Rods located this bolt!!!

[ivconic]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

http://knouzm.net/content/view/333/98/lang,en/

Hmmm ... this looks like some familiar wallet-mining.

Wow! Is it new Mineoro or just illegal copy?
I also was thinking to ask some carpenter to make me serie of simillar enclosures. Later to paint and inside to put Zahori. Of course to add more electronic gadgets inside. Battery check, voltage monitor, couple of ferrtie rods (dont know what functions those would have - but sure would look dramatic and hi pro!), few telescopic antennas, one calculator (preferably made in China), one buzzer, one speaker and of course - one vibra motor from some cell phone, of course one compass! So..at the end to wire up whole thing. Put some sticky labels over and sell by very hot prices here. Of course to claim it was imported product - not homemade!
So...i was thinking that seriously. But...than i remembered that there is no luck in cheating people. Better not having money than to get rich on somebody's else misery.
So i gave up...

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Geo

Yesterday i located with rods a place at my farm. I took my DP and i checked it. Really was a object . I dig it and i found a rust bolt.
How L Rods located this bolt!!!

The simple answer is that the rods did not detect the bolt.

Instead of just using the rods, try this:
Go to a field and stand in a random location. Throw a dice, If it's a 6 then dig a deep hole and look for any metallic objects. You can use a metal detector to do the pinpointing. If it's not a 6, then take one step in any direction, and again throw the dice. Only dig if it shows a 6. Record how many objects you find and how many empty holes you dig.

Then go out and use the rods, and again record how many objects you find and how many empty holes you dig. If you spend a full day doing both activities, in order to get some statistically significant results, you will find that there is no difference between the two.

Note that this is not a double-blind test, and is open to human error. Particularly as the person performing the test can unconsciously choose a productive area for the rods, and an unproductive area for the dice, based on visual clues.

I know that the way the rods twitch is quite compelling, but believe me it's a trick of the mind. Also, if you've never tried using a ouija board, then you should. As that's something that's even more compelling. No wonder the Victorians were so obsessed with psychic phenomenon. However, this is also s trick of the mind, and guess what? ... it's caused by the same ideomotor effect, but is greatly amplified by there being more than one person involved.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by ivconic

So...i was thinking that seriously. But...than i remembered that there is no luck in cheating people.

I am not so sure about this when i look around me .But as you say it is better to feel well in his mind than rich and corrupt.

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

... it's caused by the same ideomotor effect, but is greatly amplified by there being more than one person involved.

Yes Geo, unless you make a double blind test or equivalent, you can´t get true results. Of course if it works for you it´s fine, but if you want to understand what happens, you should do it.
If it really works double blind test will not destoy it anyway,so why not to perform it? And this is true for Dell too.

[Theseus]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

The simple answer is that the rods did not detect the bolt.

Instead of just using the rods, try this:
Go to a field and stand in a random location. Throw a dice, If it's a 6 then dig a deep hole and look for any metallic objects. You can use a metal detector to do the pinpointing. If it's not a 6, then take one step in any direction, and again throw the dice. Only dig if it shows a 6. Record how many objects you find and how many empty holes you dig.

Then go out and use the rods, and again record how many objects you find and how many empty holes you dig. If you spend a full day doing both activities, in order to get some statistically significant results, you will find that there is no difference between the two.

Exactly, that is what you will find. Also, if you really want to experience the truth about what is happening; leave the metal detector at home. Dig only where the rods indicate a target and do not double check the spot with your metal detector. If you do this many times, in an area that could have some viable targets in it, eventually you will dig down and find something that could be considered a target. However, if you keep track of the totally empty holes dug and compare those to where you may have found a target - you will once again come up with pure Chance Results. That is, you could have found the same number of targets just by guessing where to dig next.

Sorry, but that's truth of the matter, and any other concocted interpretation is strictly as was already stated; ...a trick of the mind.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Fred

If it really works double blind test will not destoy it anyway,so why not to perform it? And this is true for Dell too.

According to Dell, he has already performed 100s of double-blind tests which conclusively prove that dowsing works. Unfortunately his selective memory has managed to erase all the evidence. Shame...

[Geo]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

The simple answer is that the rods did not detect the bolt.

Instead of just using the rods, try this:
Go to a field and stand in a random location. Throw a dice, If it's a 6 then dig a deep hole and look for any metallic objects. You can use a metal detector to do the pinpointing. If it's not a 6, then take one step in any direction, and again throw the dice. Only dig if it shows a 6. Record how many objects you find and how many empty holes you dig.

Then go out and use the rods, and again record how many objects you find and how many empty holes you dig. If you spend a full day doing both activities, in order to get some statistically significant results, you will find that there is no difference between the two.

Note that this is not a double-blind test, and is open to human error. Particularly as the person performing the test can unconsciously choose a productive area for the rods, and an unproductive area for the dice, based on visual clues.

I know that the way the rods twitch is quite compelling, but believe me it's a trick of the mind. Also, if you've never tried using a ouija board, then you should. As that's something that's even more compelling. No wonder the Victorians were so obsessed with psychic phenomenon. However, this is also s trick of the mind, and guess what? ... it's caused by the same ideomotor effect, but is greatly amplified by there being more than one person involved.

Hahahaha.... Quaozhi i stop here to speak about dowsing with you. Sorry.... If one time you will come to greece, please call me to meet you, and you will see things that never will forget. You will see my friend with L rods to locate exactly coins (only copper or silver, no gold) from 1 or 2 Km away. You will see him to dig and to take out the coins WITHOUT metal detector for pinpoint. But the problem is what you will say later....
Anyway you have my regards

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Geo

Hahahaha.... Quaozhi i stop here to speak about dowsing with you. Sorry.... If one time you will come to greece, please call me to meet you, and you will see things that never will forget. You will see my friend with L rods to locate exactly coins (only copper or silver, no gold) from 1 or 2 Km away. You will see him to dig and to take out the coins WITHOUT metal detector for pinpoint. But the problem is what you will say later....
Anyway you have my regards

Like Ivconic said earlier ... we can still be friends ... skeptics and believers. You are correct. I would not believe detecting a coin from 1 or 2Km away with L rods.

In a world where people still believe that studying the positions of the stars will predict their future, wearing a magnetic bracelet on your wrist will ward off arthritis and rheumatism, and taking "medicine" (that's been diluted so many times that not one single molecule of the original remains) will still act as a cure ... there is no hope. So, swig a homeopathic drink, pop on your bracelet, consult your star map to see if you'll find treasure today, then out the door with your trusty L rods. Let's go get those coins off there in the distance. I can feel the rods twitching already!

[Fred]

Actually all those things does work, but not the way claimed by their inventors - and maybe not with everyone: you have to believe in them.
This is where resides the subtility of this matter.

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Fred

Actually all those things does work, but not the way claimed by their inventors - and maybe not with everyone: you have to believe in them.
This is where resides the subtility of this matter.

OK - but let's define what you mean by work:

1. Astrology - complete bunkum - but believing it could modify the way you approach your day. In this way it could have an effect, but it's still mystical nonsense.
2. Magnetic bracelets - placebo effect can give some relief from pain. i.e. it's really down to the individual believing that it works. Not a bad thing.
3. Homeopathy - again the placebo effect. As long as you take this stuff alongside your traditional medicine, that's fine. But as soon as you start to believe that the alternative medicine provided the cure, and next time you dispense with the working medicine, that's the danger.

It's like the L rod nonsense. If you believe it works for you, then use it. No-one will convince you otherwise, unless you really want to know the truth.

[Fred]

Originally Posted by Qiaozhi

OK - but let's define what you mean by work:

1. Astrology - complete bunkum - but believing it could modify the way you approach your day. In this way it could have an effect, but it's still mystical nonsense.
2. Magnetic bracelets - placebo effect can give some relief from pain. i.e. it's really down to the individual believing that it works. Not a bad thing.
3. Homeopathy - again the placebo effect. As long as you take this stuff alongside your traditional medicine, that's fine. But as soon as you start to believe that the alternative medicine provided the cure, and next time you dispense with the working medicine, that's the danger.

It's like the L rod nonsense. If you believe it works for you, then use it. No-one will convince you otherwise, unless you really want to know the truth.

Exactly! This is what i meant .
(I give more power of the mind over health than you seems to do, but that´s another story )

[Max]

"But the problem is what you will say later..."

BTW... I saw similar stuff... one person using rods and "detecting" stuff like this (screws, bolts, nuts, horseshoes etc most of stuff from farm machinery... big stuff also), all rusted.

But also this time the person used a conventional MD (a classic3) for pinpointing... so I was figuring out that it was coincidence and found that just cause used then the MD...

Anyway... I see clearly when rods swing/cross... but cannot say about... I tested rods myself with no crossing... I don't know about.

I cannot say it was simply the MD that found stuff... I say that cause after you see 6-7 times the guy use rods then spot target in a 50cmx50cm area with MD in open searchfield (wide farm soil) you're surprised at the end... start think that stuff works for real.

I don't know... maybe works for some people. For some others is just ideomotor !? Who can say for sure ?

Double blind tests maybe...

Kind regards,
Max

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Fred

Exactly! This is what i meant .
(I give more power of the mind over health than you seems to do, but that´s another story )

On the contrary. Mind over health definitely works .... the so-called placebo effect. It's mind over matter that I have a problem with.

Originally Posted by Max

I don't know... maybe works for some people. For some others is just ideomotor !? Who can say for sure ?

Double blind tests maybe...

It's because of the subjective nature of the tests you've described that double blind testing is a necessity. It's the only way to remove the human element.

[humhum]

Hi to all , I use 12.5Khz for nonferius metal and this is very good frequency for gold and etc.

[Dell Winders]

On the contrary. Mind over health definitely works .... the so-called placebo effect. It's mind over matter that I have a problem with

Mind over matter? Where? Are you making this stuff as you go along, or just totally confused by your own logic? Dell

[Dell Winders]

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,231148.0.html

Here is an example of MENTAL Discrimination thru Dowsing.

Does Diamond, generate a detectable "field"?
Absolutely!

Can Diamond be discriminated to mechanically with a traceable Signal line with the aid of Frequency Discrimination {MFD) ?
Absolutely! The chemical Element is "carbon", and a proper modification of the frequency will exclude Coal, Charcoal, and Hydro-Carbons.

Can Diamond be Discriminated to with the physics employed in Harmonic Induction.
Absolutely! It happens continually in nature, and it is a part of the Physics of Earth science. Dell

[J_Player]

Hi Dell,

While you are teaching us about science, can you spare a moment to answer the questions I asked above?

Can you tell us the facts about the hundreds of double blind tests you conducted?
To start with, let's focus on a single one of the tests you conducted.
Pick out any one of your hundreds of double blind you want to use for an example:
1. Where was the test conducted?
2. Who was the proctor?
3. What was the protocal of this double blind dowsing test?
4. What was the object of the double blind test? A gold item? a silver item? something else?
5. Was the operator aware of any results before the test was fully completed?
6. What were the results?

Best wishes,
J_P

[Qiaozhi]

Originally Posted by Dell Winders

Mind over matter? Where? Are you making this stuff as you go along, or just totally confused by your own logic? Dell

No ... just referring to your twisted pseudo-scientific explanations, like the one below:

Originally Posted by Dell Winders

http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.p...,231148.0.html

Here is an example of MENTAL Discrimination thru Dowsing.

Does Diamond, generate a detectable "field"?
Absolutely!

Complete rubbish! Where on Earth did you get that idea from?

Originally Posted by Dell Winders

Can Diamond be discriminated to mechanically with a traceable Signal line with the aid of Frequency Discrimination {MFD) ?
Absolutely! The chemical Element is "carbon", and a proper modification of the frequency will exclude Coal, Charcoal, and Hydro-Carbons.

Ahhh ... I suppose you're referring to the non-existent signal line. An idea dreamed up to explain why the rods twitch, when we all know the real reason.

Originally Posted by Dell Winders

Can Diamond be Discriminated to with the physics employed in Harmonic Induction.
Absolutely! It happens continually in nature, and it is a part of the Physics of Earth science. Dell

What physics is this? Presumably you mean wish-science physics.

"WHAT DOESN'T WORK, CANNOT BE MADE TO WORK."

[Dell Winders]

opps! Thats a typo error. Replace the word "generate", with the word "concentrate". Dell