transmitting schematic 10 Hz

[Qiaozhi]

Cases of people reported as being 'magnetic' abound around the world. Miroslaw is not the only one. But you are so far behind that still have not noticed that is not Miroslaw or Sam, or anybody who demonstrates this ability that matters.

Hung - you are flogging a dead horse. In the same way, reports of permanent magnet motors, and motor/generator combinations that claim to run without any input, also "abound around the world" [sic], and are complete nonsense.

Well I asked you a couple of real simple questions. So far you dodged and did not answer them. Why are you so afraid to answer if you claim to know physics and to be an electronic engineer?

No-one is going to waste time on your silly questions, as no doubt you have an alternative pseudo-scientific answer for them anyway. What's the point? You need to forget all the misleading facts you've learnt from Myron Evans and stop living in a fantasy world.

[Dell Winders]

Dr. Gullible (aka Hung) - You are such a lost soul that I almost feel sorry for you (well ... not really, I was just trying to be polite).

How can you possibly believe this trash is real? Can you not see past the end of your nose?
It's a magic trick, pure and simple; and it's not even a very good one.

Do you not realise that everyone is laughing at you?

Qiaozhi, How can you possibly believe that the Metal detecting industry is not concerned about LRL's on the market? Isn't this one of the reasons you run a Trash LRL forum, for Carl, because there is reason for a lot of concern?

In light of the evidence for concern, your telling of such an obvious big whopper lie, certainly has me and other knowledgeable people feeling sorry for your gullibility. It's hard to know if Carl has you brain washed into believing his lies, or if you promote Idiocy on your own.

Do you realize how hard I am laughing at the irrational stupidity you post on here. Apparently, you consider this as a badge of honor. Dell

[Qiaozhi]

Qiaozhi, How can you possibly believe that the Metal detecting industry is not concerned about LRL's on the market?

The legitimate metal detecting industry is in no way threatened by LRLs, with the exception that money wasted on these non-working fantasy toys is money that could have been spent on something that actually works. Apart from that they are of no interest.

Isn't this one of the reasons you run a Trash LRL forum, for Carl, because there is reason for a lot of concern?

The reason for running this "Trash LRL forum" (as you put it) is much more mundane than you choose to believe. The whole purpose of its existence is to counter the many false claims made by the sellers and distributors of dowsing and LRL devices, and to provide a skeptical view of the subject.

On the other hand, this forum is also a place where experimenters can exchange ideas, and possibly learn something new. The only way to discover the facts is do your own experiments, and not let selective memory get in the way (which is something you clearly have a problem doing yourself).

If you want to wallow in self-ignorance, and refuse to learn the hard facts, then these forums are not the place for you. Somewhere like TNET would probably better suit your agenda.

[Fred]

I have been reading the last posts and wonder if i entered a parallel universe....

I see Hung wishing that someone will lose time answering silly "technical" questions about physics, calling everyone childish names that may sound funny only to himself, and basing his hopes for an hypothetical success of long range detecting, on videos of a guy using gravity and skin adherence to hold pans on his front head.
Hung, I already noticed that you are not afraid of being ridicule, or I would sincerely feel sorry for you.

I see Dell participating actively in what he calls a trash forum, claiming that someone believing in real science is being gullible, yet not supporting any of his own surreal beliefs and claims by the smallest kind of evidence ...

I see lots of delusion and so much blindness that talking about light is considered an obscenity ...

It amazes me how apparently simple-minded persons, when confronted to an observation they cannot explain, needs to believe in the first exotic or esoteric explanation instead of being just rational...

But hey, that´s reality

[goldfinder]

Sig Gen

I have two and neither one works correctly. You sure you checked them out? Pretty sure those are all damaged goods they are trying to pawn off on unsuspecting people. Of course once you buy it you don't want to spend the money to return it to China. Get lost in the mail, etc. That's the same psychology they use on those TV ads where the product is "Not available in stores" because they know everyone will return it. Buyer beware.
.

Mike,
I've had 3, not from the $8 ad. I paid about $25 each for all three I ordered at different times.
They all worked great. A friend has one and it works fine also. So maybe there are some bad ones out there, especially the really cheap ones. I also have a calibrated lab sig gen crystal based and I checked the outputs on the Chinese versions and they were all within a hertz or 2 on the upper end and right on for the very low frequencies. Sorry to hear you got some bad ones.
Goldfinder

[goldfinder]

Good Observation

I have been reading the last posts and wonder if i entered a parallel universe....

I see Hung wishing that someone will lose time answering silly "technical" questions about physics, calling everyone childish names that may sound funny only to himself, and basing his hopes for an hypothetical success of long range detecting, on videos of a guy using gravity and skin adherence to hold pans on his front head.
Hung, I already noticed that you are not afraid of being ridicule, or I would sincerely feel sorry for you.

I see Dell participating actively in what he calls a trash forum, claiming that someone believing in real science is being gullible, yet not supporting any of his own surreal beliefs and claims by the smallest kind of evidence ...

I see lots of delusion and so much blindness that talking about light is considered an obscenity ...

It amazes me how apparently simple-minded persons, when confronted to an observation they cannot explain, needs to believe in the first exotic or esoteric explanation instead of being just rational...

But hey, that´s reality

Looks like delusions, not reality.

From Wikipedia:
A delusion is a belief held with strong conviction despite superior evidence to the contrary.[1] As a pathology, it is distinct from a belief based on false or incomplete information, confabulation, dogma, illusion, or other effects of perception.
Delusions typically occur in the context of neurological or mental illness, although they are not tied to any particular disease and have been found to occur in the context of many pathological states (both physical and mental). However, they are of particular diagnostic importance in psychotic disorders including schizophrenia, paraphrenia, manic episodes of bipolar disorder, and psychotic depression.


So most of this LRL stuff is because of mental illnesses.
Goldfinder

[Mike(Mont)]

Mike,
I've had 3, not from the $8 ad. I paid about $25 each for all three I ordered at different times.
They all worked great. A friend has one and it works fine also. So maybe there are some bad ones out there, especially the really cheap ones. I also have a calibrated lab sig gen crystal based and I checked the outputs on the Chinese versions and they were all within a hertz or 2 on the upper end and right on for the very low frequencies. Sorry to hear you got some bad ones.
Goldfinder

I bought two at different times from different sellers. Both had problems with the controls. The same problems. Amplitude and offset.

[Fred]

Looks like delusions, not reality.
Goldfinder

I meant : that´s reality here, in our forum, and world

[hung]

No-one is going to waste time on your silly questions,

Are you that insecure and frightened to the point of mixing things?
Both questions were directed to you and none else. Since I am the pseudo scientific guy as you say, I want to hear your non pseudo scientific answers then.
Fur instance...
What is magnetism?

If you know what it is, just answer.
If you don't, just say :'I don't know'.
Two options, two choices. Not too hard eh?

[Dave J.]

Too easy......

George, it's an open book question and he already provided the answer to his skeptic test question.

"Magnetism" is the force that makes bowls stick to your forehead. (Hung's Law)

A corollary is: "magnetism" is that force which makes nonmagnetic L-rods do the hokey-pokey, to which so-called "magnetic compasses" are immune and therefore useless for dowsing/LRLing.

What makes all this important, is that if a guy somewhere figured out how to make a bowl stick to his forehead without using glue, that proves that anything you can imagine about LRL's majically comes true.

--Dave J.

PS: Hung, you've provided some great entertainment with that video link! And it's informative, too, you ought to check it out!

[Dell Winders]

The legitimate metal detecting industry is in no way threatened by LRLs, with the exception that money wasted on these non-working fantasy toys is money that could have been spent on something that actually works. Apart from that they are of no interest.


The reason for running this "Trash LRL forum" (as you put it) is much more mundane than you choose to believe. The whole purpose of its existence is to counter the many false claims made by the sellers and distributors of dowsing and LRL devices, and to provide a skeptical view of the subject.

On the other hand, this forum is also a place where experimenters can exchange ideas, and possibly learn something new. The only way to discover the facts is do your own experiments, and not let selective memory get in the way (which is something you clearly have a problem doing yourself).

If you want to wallow in self-ignorance, and refuse to learn the hard facts, then these forums are not the place for you. Somewhere like TNET would probably better suit your agenda.

Unfortunately, for you & Carl, I am not wallowing in ignorance, or suffering from loss of memory. It's understandable that you would want me to leave this forum.

Since I have done more experiments and tests of LRLs and of Dowsing than any one else on this forum, according to your own criteria, I am the most uniquely qualified person to provide factual first hand information to members of this forum, and since it is a dual purpose forum, I will attempt to keep the Skeptics honest and factual as well.

So, I will try again to inform you of the facts. First, I have never seen any articles, essays, or support of Qiaozhi Beliefs, any where beyond the pages of this forum. More and more People continue to purchase expensive, over priced LRL's as more EE's and tech's get into the LRL business throughout the world. Why is that? Apparently, you are doing a poor job of educating people to conform to your erroneous beliefs.

To set the facts straight, YES, the metal detector industry has been very concerned about the growth and sale of LRL's, and the public Con jobs, and rightly so. The metal detector industry caters to the same people that you degrade as being ignorant and gullible. I know I am certainly concerned in light of the facts;

Thomas Afalini, and ELectroscope, the inventors of the term, Long Range Locating (LRL), along with the help of a popular Treasure magazine pulled off one of the biggest advertising ploys in THing history. It is reported that over a period of 6 years Electroscope took $17 million dollars in sales away from the metal detector industry. The industry was helpless to openly retaliate because of prohibitive US Anti trust laws. The major detector companies supported Compass Metal detectors in a behind the scenes bid to stop Electroscope, from advertising, which they eventually succeeded with a stop and desist order against Electroscope.

Then, along came Quadro, first sold as a Golf ball finder, then as a Treasure locator, then as a drug locator. Through their advertising ploy, they are reported to have taken another $5 million dollars in revenue in a period of two years from the Treasure Hunting industry.

Add to that, Bob Fitzgerald, has taken several Million dollars from the Metal detecting Industry, with Kellyco remaining the biggest seller of LRL's, in the world, but that is not a problem because they compensate by selling many times the amount of Metal detectors. What worker in the Metal detector industry would want to jeopardize their livelihood by putting Kellyco, out of business for selling LRL's? How about you, Qiaozhi?

So, when and where is the next gadget, or gizmo con game with a big advertising budget going to spring up and take another big bite out of Metal detector sales? Since it has already been done, it can be done again.

Now you know the truth Qiaozhi. You won't have to mis-inform your viewers any more.You can probably Google the supporting facts. Dell

[Dave J.]

In your fantasies, Dell.

I debunk LRL's because it's fun and because when you see the patterns of how people get suckered into it, you find the same patterns elsewhere for example in medical fraud. And then there's politics, which is 95% con games from both sides of the aisle. The LRL forum provides a good education for those willing to receive it.

Meanwhile back to your silly argument that metal detector manufacturers are scared schittless of LRL's. LRL's aren't even on the company president's radar screen, several years ago I found out that he didn't even know what they are, I had to explain it to him. Marketing dept. never bothered to tell him, it never occurred to them that LRL's mattered to us. The only employee of my company that posts here is me. If the boss knew that sometimes I lurk here on company time he'd probably kick my axx.

So, that's funny-- you insist that metal detector companies are afraid of LRL's. First we'd have to think that they even matter to the business, and that ain't happened yet!

Then you got the other LRLers who insist that a few metal detector companies lurk here hoping to steal good ideas and get into the LRL business. (I forget, have you played the opposite side of the fence yourself?)

If that's so, where the hell are the good ideas worth stealing? And, how is it humanly possible that someone like Carl or myself could after all these years on this (and the TNet) forums not know how to make an LRL? Hell, even Thomas and..... (drum roll) Dell Himself make 'em! And if those things were too difficult to copy, at least we could glue a pocket calculator to a coathanger. Meanwhile, Carl and George have actually published instructions on how to build an LRL and I gather several people who post here are giving it a shot.

But I gotta give you credit, Dell, we've seen silliness a lot worse. At least you're not trying to prove to the world that LRL's must work because after all, some guy on another continent sticks a bowl to his forehead.

--Dave J.

[Dell Winders]

I said concerned, not scared, or afraid. Maybe not at the moment but certainly in the past. I was there as a witness to the events. Were you?

I have no idea who you work for, or if they had any involvement in Electroscope's order to cease advertising their products in the US.

Perhaps it is your fantasy, but so far I haven't seen a pretend Psychoanalyst with a pretend dog, debunk much of anything. Heck, you aren't even a good skeptic.

A pretender you are, a psycho, possibly, a debunker, No

Not much entertainment value either. Pet the dog for me. Dell

[Dave J.]

When LRL's first came onto the scene, I presume that some people in the marketing end of the beep business were like "WTF?" and were worried because they didn't know what LRL's were and didn't know how they were going to impact markets. Engineers quickly figured out what LRL's were, but not even we could say how they were going to impact the market.

Well, that was a long time ago. The dust settled, LRL's had no more impact on beep sales than dowsing rods previously had (zilch). People who wanted to buy a metal detector weren't buying an LRL instead. Beep companies aren't worried that LRL's are gonna steal their customers.

And, reputable beep companies aren't looking for ways to get into the LRL business, the ethics of the two things are almost irreconcilable. Mineoro and OKM however did manage to put feet into both kinds of products. Don't worry, it doesn't make the rest of us jealous! If Hung is swinging a Mineoro metal detector he's kept it a secret, you would too. Just too shameful a thing to admit in public.

--Dave J.

[hung]

First of all, it's really entertaining spending some of my free time here in this forum with funny skepthics.

Dell, you are correct in your comments. I already posted, don't remember if here or in TNET, about how the use of ordinary 'floor polishers' some call 'standard metal detectors' has dramatically decreased in mining areas in Brazil.
It's not fair to compare the much greater amount of natural gold existing in Brazil to that in the USA. And by this very reason the dramatic decrease of miners using them is of concern, as it means decrease in sales also.
Miners in Brazil now use primarily LRLs of all types to locate the deposits from far away and reach the potential area coordinates.

I also made a prediction over TNET that in some years from now, very few people would be using these floor polishers, except for kids having fun in the beach as those devices would be considered ordinary toys.
Well, I think my prediction has already started to happen in Brazil...

It also amazes me how in the USA, there exists manufacturers who still make and sell crap regarding ordinary 'metal detectors' and despite of that, australian minelab still beats the usa toys.
You see, this technology and aproach has not changed in 100 years.
Heck, can you envision the big canadian gold prospecting corporations using floor polishers to find deposits of gold around the world?

So, it's fair that people like dave j, aka wharf, aka toto, who works for Fisher, hang around here desperate to get his hands in a LRL that he can successfully clone and sell other than the crappy metal detectors he produces.