Testing Crypton OBMD-1

[Sood]

Hi and privit,

Your english is fine. And there always is a difference between technical english and universal talking.

If the weather is bad or if there is snow the very weak
"special detection field-strengh" will be reduced alot.

Let's hope Andreas has alot success to make the OBMD
more sensitive and tunable for different weather-conditions
and the ground generator works on a reliable basis.

Privit!
I want to believe that OBMD will work reliably in all weather conditions and all countries ...

[Funfinder]

Privit!
I want to believe that OBMD will work reliably in all weather conditions and all countries ...

If the circuit is flexible enough for adjustment and high sensitive
it should work everywhere and also if weather is not optimal.



Someone should invite Andreas for a nice holiday-trip around all the
European countries so he can test it everywhere.

A treasure hunter that has found already 10kg of pure gold
or a huge company may sponsor him.

It would pays off for shure if the OBMD works and sells good.

[Sood]

If the circuit is flexible enough for adjustment and high sensitive
it should work everywhere and also if weather is not optimal.



Someone should invite Andreas for a nice holiday-trip around all the
European countries so he can test it everywhere.

A treasure hunter that has found already 10kg of pure gold
or a huge company may sponsor him.

It would pays off for shure if the OBMD works and sells good.

If OBMD will actually work, Andreas is able to travel around the world for free. Will be very much willing to invite Andreas to his country to find the treasure.

[Funfinder]

Would be really important if Andreas could manage to
visit this thread at least once a weak and informs us
about all the news.

If weather already is warm enough in Greece we would
like to hear also about the newest outdoor test-results.

[ANDREAS]

If weather already is warm enough in Greece we would
like to hear also about the newest outdoor test-results.

We have done all the tests in the previous year. The problem is.. video's presentation of me, in my opinion is not objective. In this area I work, and I am looking for a method of becoming a video without my presence. I don't want doubt. I wait a test to be done in America (maybe next week) and will be announced after the way, how to do test in Europe without a doubt.
This is risk for me, but definitely a machine that is better than it has been presented so far in the world-market, worth the effort.
It's also a good opportunity to stop "those who say they know and in fact are ignorant" to stop the fairy tales
regards

[Funfinder]

Hi,

> The problem is.. video's presentation of me, in my opinion is not objective.

You must to do a real good job if you wanna be accepted here in this forum. But if you can succeed, you will be the king of LRLs!

The situation is very bad here:
We have persons like Dell Winders and others who claim their LRLs would really work - but they can't provide hard enough facts.

We have Mineoro and OKM and their reputation here is very low.


You're right, video is no objective argument if it comes to Country!

You would need respectful persons on your side who have to lose their pride, reputation or good image and who confirm that your LRL was working at this and that location under this and that weather conditions.

No easy task. If you have the chance you can start to visit close nearby sites within Greece, 20km, 80km, 200km away from Athens.

If you get successful hunting-results there, also at 200km distance, it is likely that it also will work outside Greece. Next you can test it 500-1000km away north, south, east and west.

Without such tests the same situation as with Mineoro and OKM will happen - people won't buy it from distant countries because it doesn't work.


Of course there would be a simple way around:
Therefore you must give us a simple test schematic you have tested it works in Greece so people in America, northern Europe, Asia or other countries can built and test it theirselves.

I doubt you will do that, highly probable you will think that way your furrs will swim away and you will not have "exclusive business", but seen from the opposite, you will have no good business at all if the info makes the round that the Crypton doesn't work outside Greece.

You have to decide.


And if you wait too long to provide realistic, proven, reliable and trustworthy info the interest for your LRLs will vanish very soon.

I guess around 75% of all people here in this forum already doesn't believe your LRLs really work anyway. Too many frustrating and criminal things have happend already!


With only vague info and avoiding to tell about all kind of clear and needed facts only the suspicion will raise.


I think at least you have to made public on what principle it works and that this principle proven and testable works.


Or do you have better ideas how to convince interested treasure-hunters why spent a huge amount of money for your products?

The argument:
"Perhaps or maybe the LRL will find something"
does not work.


We must see it realistic. Its sad that you have to pay some price now because of all those many LRL-fraudsters and mysterious-chandlers who ruined the complete LRL-reputation extremly !!!

But no problem for you, if you can offer a real working product and if you are able to convince the treasure-hunting-community that and how good it really works.


Good luck!

[g-sani]

Hi,

> The problem is.. video's presentation of me, in my opinion is not objective.

You must to do a real good job if you wanna be accepted here in this forum. But if you can succeed, you will be the king of LRLs!

The situation is very bad here:
We have persons like Dell Winders and others who claim their LRLs would really work - but they can't provide hard enough facts.

We have Mineoro and OKM and their reputation here is very low.


You're right, video is no objective argument if it comes to Country!

You would need respectful persons on your side who have to lose their pride, reputation or good image and who confirm that your LRL was working at this and that location under this and that weather conditions.

No easy task. If you have the chance you can start to visit close nearby sites within Greece, 20km, 80km, 200km away from Athens.

If you get successful hunting-results there, also at 200km distance, it is likely that it also will work outside Greece. Next you can test it 500-1000km away north, south, east and west.

Without such tests the same situation as with Mineoro and OKM will happen - people won't buy it from distant countries because it doesn't work.


Of course there would be a simple way around:
Therefore you must give us a simple test schematic you have tested it works in Greece so people in America, northern Europe, Asia or other countries can built and test it theirselves.

I doubt you will do that, highly probable you will think that way your furrs will swim away and you will not have "exclusive business", but seen from the opposite, you will have no good business at all if the info makes the round that the Crypton doesn't work outside Greece.

You have to decide.


And if you wait too long to provide realistic, proven, reliable and trustworthy info the interest for your LRLs will vanish very soon.

I guess around 75% of all people here in this forum already doesn't believe your LRLs really work anyway. Too many frustrating and criminal things have happend already!


With only vague info and avoiding to tell about all kind of clear and needed facts only the suspicion will raise.


I think at least you have to made public on what principle it works and that this principle proven and testable works.


Or do you have better ideas how to convince interested treasure-hunters why spent a huge amount of money for your products?

The argument:
"Perhaps or maybe the LRL will find something"
does not work.


We must see it realistic. Its sad that you have to pay some price now because of all those many LRL-fraudsters and mysterious-chandlers who ruined the complete LRL-reputation extremly !!!

But no problem for you, if you can offer a real working product and if you are able to convince the treasure-hunting-community that and how good it really works.


Good luck!

My opinion Funfinder is that it will take much time until most of the people realise that an LRL really works.In cases like this that somebody has to adjust the sensitivity sometimes to the very limit will also need time to learn and use it out in the field which is completely different from testing it in front of a tv set.
What I believe is that somebody has to play whith the fine sensitivity button while detecting and this is a necessity in order to understand if a target is real or not.
What an LRL user wants at the begining is to have just constant signals or in other words "having continually beeps on the same lines". My experience says that usually you also get some other beeps that you have to decide if they come from targets or not.Checking them if they come randomly is one way to judge.But then it might be another target further away which probably reaches the LRL's detecting range and you have to consider such a possibility as well.
This is why you need to work whith the fine button increasing or decreasing sensitivity by small increments and check everytime you do it the outcome coming from your locator.
While decreasing sensitivity for example one thing you will look for is to see if it will be a time that you only get just one signal line.
And of course this would be the ideal case.
I am saying all this as a proof to my belief that LRLs also need the users brain to work in order to get the results we desire.
Skeptics probably would be happier to see an LRL that digs as well.
Yes, I wouldn't be surprised.
Regards
g-sani

[Funfinder]

Very good reply, g-sani!


> My opinion Funfinder is that it will take much time until most of the people realise that an LRL really works.


Correct, this also has to to with technical understanding, having a feeling already how to deal with delicated tuned or high sensitive electronics - so around 20% may have all this already and the rest will need some time for the needed learning-curve.

BUT: This only is an option if those people are working with a LRL that really works at all, and 80% of all available devices in this region are pure bulls**t!


And the "real working LRLs" with its almost criminal aura of secrecty and "magic-processor-inside - philosophy" (because many of their producers refuses all kinds of scientifical tests or even thinking!) only work if the working-principle behinds is versatile and flexible enough.

Who needs LRLs that only works finetuned 10km around the region of the company?! No one!


Per instance if that LRL is based on earth magnetical field induction it has to be able to deal with very different field strenghts!
If the sensitivity tuner can't handle this range it is worthless!



Check out:
International Geomagnetic Reference Field (IGRF)

http://www.ngdc.noaa.gov/IAGA/vmod/igrf.html

see grafic below - huge differences!

Equator fieldstrenght: 30 microTesla (uT) (1 uT = 1000 nanoTesla nT)
Middle-Europe: 48 (20 uT horizontally, 44 uT vertically)
earth pole region: 60 uT


> While decreasing sensitivity for example one thing you will look for is to see if it will be a time that you only get just one signal line.

Such problems may occure, especially if the LRL doesn't use enough directional antennas if this is possible or if the contrast factor of the detection circuit creates too blurry signals.


But on top of all this is the commitment of the LRL producer that he provides povable facts and results that his device is really capable in detecting the stated and declared stuff at all.

And the users brain is no excuse for devices that are built far too complicated, unreliable or not working at specific regions at all.



btw. it is a very bad signal that Mineoro, who already worked with those know passive-LW-receiver PDK circuits 30 years ago still is not able to produce a real working product, otherwise not such dirty and criminal tricks would have to be used!

If Mineoro would haved fooled me personally and robbed me 10.000 dollars that way they would pay already a high price! For me those are very poor persons who let deceive them, let steal them thousands of dollars and afterwards simply do nothing! Poor, helpless and stupid people, nothing than sad "victims" !


Those Mineoro circuits have failed big time!

And Morgan or Geo also may improve their "old-school" circuits for 30 years from now on and I doubt they will achieve any "better" results as Mineoro got already! Thats the price for the whole non-transparency and secretiveness!

"If you look long enough into the abyss, the abyss will start to look out of yourself!" (Friedrich Nietzsche)


For luck we have Andreas who is know as correctly working so far and we will see if he fails or if he will do a good job. For shure he will have to do alot professional convincing puplicity work to overcome critical things which have been destroyed in the domain of LRL since many years like, especially trust and confidence...

In the whole treasure-hunting community perhaps meanwhile only 1% believes that a LRL really works and metal-detector dealers fear for their good reputation if they offer such dubious devices.

A very high price for the creme de la creme of treasure detectors!

[g-sani]

.................................................. ..........
.................................................. ..........
.................................................. ........
Check out:
International Geomagnetic Reference Field (IGRF)
http://www.ngdc.noaa.gov/IAGA/vmod/igrf.html
see grafic below - huge differences!
Equator fieldstrenght: 30 microTesla (uT) (1 uT = 1000 nanoTesla nT)
Middle-Europe: 48 (20 uT horizontally, 44 uT vertically)
earth pole region: 60 uT................................................ .............
.................................................. ...........................................

Hi Funfinder,
once many years ago I came accross a program from National Geographic that you could give it some place on earth and it could give you the field strength in that particular place.
I remember it was a time I was trying to figure out why it might be possible for a mineoro to work over there and not here in Greece.I was surprised to find out the big difference in field strength.
Regards

[WM6]

I was surprised to find out the big difference in field strength.

They say that difference exist between continents (par example: South America shows everywhere good phenomena to mineoro fraudulent boxes).

But as we can see on field-mag-maps differences are everywhere not only between continents.

Probably there is not about mag-field strength, but about naive-believe strength.

[g-sani]

They say that difference exist between continents (par example: South America shows everywhere good phenomena to mineoro fraudulent boxes).

But as we can see on field-mag-maps differences are everywhere not only between continents.

Probably there is not about mag-field strength, but about naive-believe strength.

Never say never

[Morgan]

Very good reply, g-sani!


> My opinion Funfinder is that it will take much time until most of the people realise that an LRL really works.


Correct, this also has to to with technical understanding, having a feeling already how to deal with delicated tuned or high sensitive electronics - so around 20% may have all this already and the rest will need some time for the needed learning-curve.

BUT: This only is an option if those people are working with a LRL that really works at all, and 80% of all available devices in this region are pure bulls**t!


And the "real working LRLs" with its almost criminal aura of secrecty and "magic-processor-inside - philosophy" (because many of their producers refuses all kinds of scientifical tests or even thinking!) only work if the working-principle behinds is versatile and flexible enough.

Who needs LRLs that only works finetuned 10km around the region of the company?! No one!


Per instance if that LRL is based on earth magnetical field induction it has to be able to deal with very different field strenghts!
If the sensitivity tuner can't handle this range it is worthless!



Check out:
International Geomagnetic Reference Field (IGRF)

http://www.ngdc.noaa.gov/IAGA/vmod/igrf.html

see grafic below - huge differences!

Equator fieldstrenght: 30 microTesla (uT) (1 uT = 1000 nanoTesla nT)
Middle-Europe: 48 (20 uT horizontally, 44 uT vertically)
earth pole region: 60 uT


> While decreasing sensitivity for example one thing you will look for is to see if it will be a time that you only get just one signal line.

Such problems may occure, especially if the LRL doesn't use enough directional antennas if this is possible or if the contrast factor of the detection circuit creates too blurry signals.


But on top of all this is the commitment of the LRL producer that he provides povable facts and results that his device is really capable in detecting the stated and declared stuff at all.

And the users brain is no excuse for devices that are built far too complicated, unreliable or not working at specific regions at all.



btw. it is a very bad signal that Mineoro, who already worked with those know passive-LW-receiver PDK circuits 30 years ago still is not able to produce a real working product, otherwise not such dirty and criminal tricks would have to be used!

If Mineoro would haved fooled me personally and robbed me 10.000 dollars that way they would pay already a high price! For me those are very poor persons who let deceive them, let steal them thousands of dollars and afterwards simply do nothing! Poor, helpless and stupid people, nothing than sad "victims" !


Those Mineoro circuits have failed big time!

And Morgan or Geo also may improve their "old-school" circuits for 30 years from now on and I doubt they will achieve any "better" results as Mineoro got already! Thats the price for the whole non-transparency and secretiveness!

"If you look long enough into the abyss, the abyss will start to look out of yourself!" (Friedrich Nietzsche)


For luck we have Andreas who is know as correctly working so far and we will see if he fails or if he will do a good job. For shure he will have to do alot professional convincing puplicity work to overcome critical things which have been destroyed in the domain of LRL since many years like, especially trust and confidence...

In the whole treasure-hunting community perhaps meanwhile only 1% believes that a LRL really works and metal-detector dealers fear for their good reputation if they offer such dubious devices.

A very high price for the creme de la creme of treasure detectors!

hi

thanks a lot for this amazing world strenght field picture,this is very useful.
I see my country and Greece with the same strenght values,both in the white area...and for example Mexico with three diferent strenght values according territory extention,this is very interesting,and maybe the reason why Sood experience N S lines with his PDK,UKRAIN is in very diferent ground value from here,see in the picture.


regards

[Funfinder]

@ g-sani

> I remember it was a time I was trying to figure out why it might be possible for a mineoro to work over there and not here in Greece.

Shure, there are differences, but Mineoro should have known about it and built in an adjustable enough range for the finetuning.


Lets assume the field strenght on earth is inbetween a level of 10-100 uTesla.

And the field-change effect if there is a buried metal is from 0.1 - 0.01 uTesla (10-100 nano Tesla).

So there are two different fine-tuning circuits needed, one from 10-100 uTesla to cover the complete earth and one that goes on an extra level from 0.01 to 0.1 or even better from 0.01 to 1 uTesla for the very weak treasure magnetfield-distortions.



WM6:
> Probably there is not about mag-field strength, but about naive-believe strength.

Good point, especially if the magnetical signal line is assumed 1km long, I highly doubt that after such a large distance it is still possible to get a clear signal, even if the find is 15m large. Much more probable you will detect differences of huge ground-mineralization-areas that way, per instance if a mountain is close nearby that contains ore.

From what distance was reported the most far away LRL-find so far? 100 meters for a huge metal-chest???

Everything beyond 100 meters should be seen very skeptical to be detectable at all.



But at lower range such a "handhold pistol motion magnetometer" for shure can work and pick up signals from the horizontal field curves and distortions if the contrast-level is high / clearly interpretable / enough.


btw. I guess this is now offtopic here, because the Crypton does work on a different basis / principle than the PDK. I also doubt that Andreas will induce magnetical field lines with his "ground-generator".




Thanks for the reply, Morgan.

> I see my country and Greece with the same strenght values,both in the white area...and for example Mexico with three diferent strenght values according territory extention

I hope we can find a much more detailed map, and those values also change every year.

The earthmagnetical field is multi-segmented, not like a bar magnet, even if the strongest areas are at the poles.

It also will depend alot how many meters of mineralized ground someone has below his feets and how this mineralization changes.

Next we have horizontal but also vertical magnetic field lines which means that the magnetical-coil will get different readings if hold horizontal, vertical or at an angle of 45°. Sometimes the field-lines come out from the earth very flat, sometimes very steep.


Morgan, to get an european-wide working PDK the best method would be:

1: finding an accurate, up to date and much more detailed map
2: visiting places in Portugal (if there are any) or close nearby which already have significantly changed field-conditions and check out at this locations how you can adjust the PDK
3: built in a preset switch (analog switch with different resistors or capacitors) so a person can chose directly highly different magneticfield-conditions

4: try to create different conditions by portable electromagnets or strong permanent-magnets outside under real testfield conditions and adjust PDK to new sitation (this may help to understand where exactly those needed adjustments must be made)

5: check out if at mountains in Portugal or spain the field-Strenght is highly changed

[g-sani]

While talking about differences in field strength and according to different places I am very sure that soil conditions affect its value in a big proportion.
Is it?
It seems to me logical that it will be a big difference in strength value when in a high mineralised ground.Especially if we have mineralised rocks.I noticed many times that you leave a place going a few kms further away and you are allready having a problem adjusting your MD.
Does it have to do whith the electromagnetic field strength that is completely different in this place? But where is this fact coming from?
It might be big changes in strength value from place to place and never mind about being in a different country.
Even a simple compass can show disturbances in a highly mineralised field.
Probably there are so many parameters that we are trying to combine them as a single one.
Not very easy.
I believe it will be always limitations when it comes to LRLs and don't say I am wrong in that.

[Funfinder]

> a place going a few kms further away and you are allready having a problem adjusting your MD.

Which MD?


> Does it have to do whith the electromagnetic field strength that is completely different in this place? But where is this fact coming from?

An usual MD should be immune against the earths magnetic field.

The soil and the metallic minerals of the bedrock for shure will influnce the earths magneticfield alot.

And depending on the minerals some or many of the metal molecules are aligning with this field.

Perhaps this is the reason why an usual metal-detector destroys the very weak "LRL phenomenon signal". It demagnetized the ground or soil at an area of its radiated MDs detection field range (perhaps up to 5 meter!).