LRL Ionic/Electrostatic energy field locator

[Mike(Mont)]

I guess maybe I should have said CHILD psychology.

[Theseus]

I guess maybe I should have said CHILD psychology.

Well, whatever you've had the most experience, and feel comfortable with.

[J_Player]

I can never see collecting any money for supposedly demonstrating supernatural powers while using a frequency generator, with or without a locator rod. I certainly don't think it is supernatural anymore than tuning a radio station is.

Yup....
I can never see you collecting any money while using a frequency generator, with or without a locator rod either.
Will anybody ever see you collecting money or anything else with it?

Maybe your facts about dowsing exist in your mind only, and cannot be demonstrated to be facts in front of any witnesses...

Best wishes,
J_P

[Mike(Mont)]

Sorry, I don't talk about my treasure projects. As for drug usage, I just did a pre-employment drug and alcohol screen earlier this month (got the job). I guess I can understand you are envious of my locating ability. You funny.

Just like Jesus said that anyone could perform the miracles He did, if only you had as much faith as in His little finger. Also He said you need to frame questions for a yes/no answer. From what many people think, he went to India and became a Yoga master. There were about fifteen years unaccounted for in His life and this is about the normal amount of time needed for that. He was able to transcend the physical world. I'm starting to see how the skeptic and atheist are intertwined

[Theseus]

Yup....
I can never see you collecting any money while using a frequency generator, with or without a locator rod either.
Will anybody ever see you collecting money or anything else with it?

Maybe your facts about dowsing exist in your mind only, and cannot be demonstrated to be facts in front of any witnesses...

Best wishes,
J_P

Doesn't want to talk about his (Mike) "locating projects" ????

I think I know why.

J_P, I'm not for certain, but I think Mike just made an "inference" that skeptics are atheists.

I'm starting to see how the skeptic and atheist are intertwined...

I think mentally, he is more than just a little unstable, and certainly is very irritated about being questioned as to his dowsing abilities and obviously extremely paranoid in his thinking. I hope his future employer screens him for more than just drugs; a psychological evaluation would certainly reveal some interesting traits.

[Max]

Sorry, I don't talk about my treasure projects. As for drug usage, I just did a pre-employment drug and alcohol screen earlier this month (got the job). I guess I can understand you are envious of my locating ability. You funny.

Just like Jesus said that anyone could perform the miracles He did, if only you had as much faith as in His little finger. Also He said you need to frame questions for a yes/no answer. From what many people think, he went to India and became a Yoga master. There were about fifteen years unaccounted for in His life and this is about the normal amount of time needed for that. He was able to transcend the physical world. I'm starting to see how the skeptic and atheist are intertwined

There are tricks to pass the screens and got the job...

But the best is pass them when under drugz...

You need to be more "creative" Mike...

[simonbaker]

Fun discussion, beats working...

I'm open to dowsing, but not for selling to others unless some kind of proven results, otherwise unethical.

I can imagine many ways dowsing can be "real". For example, dowsers may be good at finding "caches" hidden by other people. Why? Because they have an innate ability to guess where other people prefer to hide something. I'm sure people do not randomly pick places to hide caches -- they use some decision making process. Dowsers are very intuitive and can essentially project themselves into the mind-set of the hider, and make good guesses where it might be hidden.

Dowsers may also have a natural intuition about looking at the land and guessing where minerals might deposit or collect during the geological processes -- especially water flow.

Could dowsers be picking up other signals from the environment that help improve their guessing ability? Why not.

Dowsing may be a lot of fun -- after all, going outside and hunting is the real fun of metal detecting. The thrill of finding something adds to it, whether it was by accident or design. Dowsers surely find things occasionally, so it's got to be fun.

However, if you want to sell dowsing to other people for personal gain, I feel you ethically need to back up any claims you make with some sort of proof. If all you claim is that it is fun -- no problem!

On the other hand, enough people are skeptical of dowsing that to some degree the warnings are out there, and if you like to spend money to join a spiritual community -- ok, go ahead. It's like joining a church and putting money in the collection plate -- nobody proves God, yet many people do it for the value of being part of the spirtual community.

So non-believers don't need to bash dowsers too violently -- just keep doing scientific tests of dowsing and publishing the results so the general public is well-informed. And I would hope that dowsing marketers be honest and up-front about their claims - more disclaimers (your results may be different), etc.

But this is boring... so back to flame-throwing, much more entertaining!

-SB

[J_Player]

Fun discussion, beats working...

I'm open to dowsing, but not for selling to others unless some kind of proven results, otherwise unethical.

I can imagine many ways dowsing can be "real". For example, dowsers may be good at finding "caches" hidden by other people. Why? Because they have an innate ability to guess where other people prefer to hide something. I'm sure people do not randomly pick places to hide caches -- they use some decision making process. Dowsers are very intuitive and can essentially project themselves into the mind-set of the hider, and make good guesses where it might be hidden.

Dowsers may also have a natural intuition about looking at the land and guessing where minerals might deposit or collect during the geological processes -- especially water flow.

Could dowsers be picking up other signals from the environment that help improve their guessing ability? Why not.

Dowsing may be a lot of fun -- after all, going outside and hunting is the real fun of metal detecting. The thrill of finding something adds to it, whether it was by accident or design. Dowsers surely find things occasionally, so it's got to be fun.

However, if you want to sell dowsing to other people for personal gain, I feel you ethically need to back up any claims you make with some sort of proof. If all you claim is that it is fun -- no problem!

On the other hand, enough people are skeptical of dowsing that to some degree the warnings are out there, and if you like to spend money to join a spiritual community -- ok, go ahead. It's like joining a church and putting money in the collection plate -- nobody proves God, yet many people do it for the value of being part of the spirtual community.

So non-believers don't need to bash dowsers too violently -- just keep doing scientific tests of dowsing and publishing the results so the general public is well-informed. And I would hope that dowsing marketers be honest and up-front about their claims - more disclaimers (your results may be different), etc.

But this is boring... so back to flame-throwing, much more entertaining!

-SB

Hi simonbaker,

The argument against dowsing has been known for a long time. The argument is "if it works, then show us it working".
There are no dowsers submitting their "dowsing abilities" to scientific testing.
Why?
Because It makes them look silly when witnesses observe they can't dowse after hearing all their diatribe of how dowsing works.
The bashing you see here is mostly cases where some personal artifacts crept into the forum posts. But the argument remains the same:
If a person can dowse, then demonstrate it instead of talking about it.
People in a technical forum like to see a technically correct test of dowsing, like a double blind test, for example. Yet none of the self-proclaimed dowsers has ever demonstrated their dowsing abilities in front of witnesses from this forum to show that dowsing works.

Let's suppose Mike(Mont) is correct... that everyone has the ability, and it is an act of faith that will allow us to succeed.
Then send the faithful dowser to demonstrate how their faith allows them to dowse.

Or suppose dowsing supporters are correct when they say it works by using natural biological equipment in their body. Then let those supporters demonstrate how their natural biological equipment allows them to dowse.

Or suppose those who say only a few gifted people can dowse. Then send one of these gifted people to demonstrate how their gift allows them to dowse.

The fact is not a single person on earth has ever come to demonstrate dowsing to locate a hidden object to the people they try to convince in this forum.
Doesn't this make dowsing seem like a suspicious proposition?
Does it work as well as a Ouija board?
Does it work as well as holding a weather vane to see which way the wind blows the arrow?
We will never know because none of the self-proclaimed dowsing experts will demonstrate it to work.

I wouldn't worry about people getting challenged in this forum.
Remember the rules for this forum:

Rules are still simple:

• You must be a registered user to post here. Guests may read.
• Be polite. Name calling will get you banned quickly.
• Be factual. If you make an extraordinary claim, be prepared to get challenged.

If somebody wants a good bashing, they know all they have to do is come here and make some extraordinary claims, then refuse to substantiate them. This is like a free therapy forum for people seeking masochism. Maybe it does some good. Maybe the people who come here feel they need a good bashing as punishment for something really bad they did. Or maybe they just get a feeling of fulfillment when they see people laugh at their ideas. Who knows?

They certainly have the option to not post here, or to post their dowsing claims in other forums where people don't expect them to substantiate anything they say. I guess this what makes some people happy. Maybe they like hearing the challenges.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Theseus]

Hi simonbaker,

<< things snipped >>

If somebody wants a good bashing, they know all they have to do is come here and make some extraordinary claims, then refuse to substantiate them. This is like a free therapy forum for people seeking masochism. Maybe it does some good. Maybe the people who come here feel they need a good bashing as punishment for something really bad they did. Or maybe they just get a feeling of fulfillment when they see people laugh at their ideas. Who knows?

They certainly have the option to not post here, or to post their dowsing claims in other forums where people don't expect them to substantiate anything they say. I guess this what makes some people happy. Maybe they like hearing the challenges.

Best wishes,
J_P

There is one other motive for posting here; some of the LRL sellers like to keep their name (and mention of their dowsing contraptions) popping up in dowsing forums. They do this as a part of their marketing scheme, and thus obtain free advertising. Their hope is that one or more gullible and technically-challenged individual will actually believe their wild claims and result in a future sale.

And, at the prices they charge for their contraptions, do-nothing frequency generators, paint-roller handles and PVC plumbing fittings - it only takes one fool with more money than common sense; to net them a handsome profit.

[Max]

There is one other motive for posting here; some of the LRL sellers like to keep their name (and mention of their dowsing contraptions) popping up in dowsing forums. They do this as a part of their marketing scheme, and thus obtain free advertising. Their hope is that one or more gullible and technically-challenged individual will actually believe their wild claims and result in a future sale.

And, at the prices they charge for their contraptions, do-nothing frequency generators, paint-roller handles and PVC plumbing fittings - it only takes one fool with more money than common sense; to net them a handsome profit.

Oh yeah!

Holy words!

And I will add the pendulum things to the list... the stuff Dell use to pinpoint treasures from his armchair...

[Dell Winders]

Sorry, I would never sell my magic needle & Thread pendulum for less than 10 cents, and you pay the shipping costs.

I read that Scientist conducting the latest brain wave studies have concluded that humans are psychic on a sub-conscious level. I don't argue with science, just serve as an example. Dell

[Theseus]

Sorry, I would never sell my magic needle & Thread pendulum for less than 10 cents, and you pay the shipping costs.

Dell

....and did you forget the 20% Restocking Fee on any and all refunds???

[J_Player]

Sorry, I would never sell my magic needle & Thread pendulum for less than 10 cents, and you pay the shipping costs.

I read that Scientist conducting the latest brain wave studies have concluded that humans are psychic on a sub-conscious level. I don't argue with science, just serve as an example. Dell

Ummm....
Will you sell an Omnitron Pro-4 frequency discriminator for 10 cents if I pay the shipping costs?

ps. I think I am psychic on a subconscious level: Answer to my question is -- No. Correct?

Best wishes,

J_P

[Dell Winders]

....and did you forget the 20% Restocking Fee on any and all refunds???

You are confusing me with your friends who sell metal detectors. I don charge restocking fees. Dell

[Qiaozhi]

I read that Scientist conducting the latest brain wave studies have concluded that humans are psychic on a sub-conscious level. I don't argue with science, just serve as an example. Dell

Please supply the source of your information regarding these so-called "latest brain wave studies". Otherwise it is just hearsay ... or, as the Chinese say it: "tingshuo" ( 听说).