In my system, in the radio...

[Fred]

I'm leaving practical experiences 30 years in this matter, differences...

If you don´t progress, you regress...
Nothing personal Esteban, just about facts.

Hi Fred,
Did you read what Seden wrote?
Gold can leach as ions and become traces of microscopic gold particles mixed in the soil at the surface. Maybe not much gold, but suppose we built a large IR searchlight ... maybe 50 IR lasers in a cylinder all pulsed at the same time and aimed it at the dirt. If there was enough power, then maybe the microscopic gold particles at the surface would vibrate hard enough to cause the dirt to start jiggling. Then you could walk around and listen for the sound of oscillating dirt to find your treasure location.

But be careful not to look toward the IR lasers.

Best wishes,
J_P

Yes, JP, we should try this sometime.Just a truck-sized detector should suffice.
but then i wonder what we can do if the soil only contain gold particles and nuggets/coins/bars....

[J_Player]

...Yes, JP, we should try this sometime. Just a truck-sized detector should suffice.
but then i wonder what we can do if the soil only contain gold particles and nuggets/coins/bars....

Hi Fred,
If you are using a 10 KW generator to power the IR laser array and you come to some gold nuggets and bars,
then you will be in danger of possible injury or death from melting gold objects moving about.

I suggest you take suitable precautions to keep safe from injury:

[WM6]

With only 2 IR leds you detect a 0.5 cm long 3 mm diameter copper wire at 5 meters, buried 10 cm or less.

For sure, if you know where wire is buried. As always in your magic tricks.

[Fred]

but then i wonder what we can do if the soil only contain gold particles and nuggets/coins/bars....

I meant "but then i wonder what we can do if the soil only contain gold particles and NO nuggets/coins/bars"
Forgot to read before posting

[Seden]

Good Point

"but then i wonder what we can do if the soil only contain gold particles and NO nuggets/coins/bars"

That's a very valid question and in that case you end up with an empty hole in the ground. That equally applies to Geochemical Prospecting which happened to me several years ago. I had soil samples from several areas and this one spot had so much micron gold the test tube bubbled over and I thought EUREKA!! Upon drywashing the soil and running the cons I came up empty handed and realized I was in an area that could only be leached to get the gold out but boy howdy it is a very pregnant spot!

Randy

[Esteban]

[quote=Fred;102833]If you don´t progress, you regress...
Nothing personal Esteban, just about facts.]

Who said I'm in regression? You? Facts? I have 1,000!

[Esteban]

I meant "but then i wonder what we can do if the soil only contain gold particles and NO nuggets/coins/bars"
Forgot to read before posting

I think this is not normal in you...

[detectoman]

no te desesperes esteban con todos estos comentarios yo te entiendo, ya lo has dicho demasiado, y aun no te leen?

[Astrodetect]

Thanks Esteban for your information, I believe your experiences.You are fortunate to have all these experiences.
Now for the skeptics, can somebody please explain with scientific facts why an IR modulated beam CANNOT shift its frequency and phase when its in the presence of an electromagnetic field of a buried metal, or if prefer, in a magnetic field anomaly of a buried metal?
I would like to hear FACTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[J_Player]

Thanks Esteban for your information, I believe your experiences.You are fortunate to have all these experiences.
Now for the skeptics, can somebody please explain with scientific facts why an IR modulated beam CANNOT shift its frequency and phase when its in the presence of an electromagnetic field of a buried metal, or if prefer, in a magnetic field anomaly of a buried metal?
I would like to hear FACTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am a skeptic about what Esteban posted. But I am not skeptical the question you asked.

My argument is with the words Esteban posted, not what you are asking to prove.
What Esteban posted was a page showing a metal sample in an acoustic isolated container that had a microphone attached to listen for vibrating sounds it makes when a pulsed IR light beam shines on it.

We all read what Esteban posted:

"... is the phase shift.

Exactly as I made with a FM radio since more than 20 years ago! So, IR can be used for electronic LRL."

The fact is it is not exactly the same. It is not even similar. Esteban comes here with the intent to collect his glory as a great experimenter and innovator, which he is. But he distributes misinformation in order to collect his glory. This is the Geotech forum, the most highly respected technical metal locating forum in the world. And it is wrong to use false information to prove you are a glorious innovator. The result is there are readers all over the world believing Esteban's buried gold targets are vibrating under the ground causing RF phase shift, when he has performed no testing to verify there is any vibration happening in his buried target metals. He is publishing his declaration of "Exactly as I made with a FM radio since more than 20 years ago" based on pure speculation.

The fact is Esteban does not know whether his buried targets are vibrating or not. He has not made a single test in all his years to measure any acoustic vibrations as shown in the paper he posted. All he knows is his FM radio sound changes when he shines his detector at a place where he says there is a buried treasure. The proof is easy to make, but he has not done it.

And now you are asking skeptics to explain with scientific facts why an IR modulated beam CANNOT shift its frequency and phase when its in the presence of an electromagnetic field of a buried metal. Nobody here said that can't be done. What I said is the acoustic waves we see in the paper Esteban posted are not the same as what Esteban did with an FM radio since more than 20 years ago. There is a big difference between listening to acoustic sounds of a vibrating chunk of metal, and listening to a variation in a sound from an FM radio that has it's RF altered.

One thing Esteban didn't explain is the sound variation he heard from the FM radio was never verified to be caused by a phase shift. The truth is that Esteban does not know what causes the change in the sound. Maybe it was caused by a phase shift, or maybe it was caused by a second frequency interfering, or maybe some kind of modulation on the carrier. But Esteban has no clue what electronic fluctuation causes the audio change. Can Esteban supply some way to demonstrate that there was a indeed phase shift in the signal received on his FM radio? ... Or is this more speculation that he is assuming must be true because he concluded the buried metal started vibrating?

Has it ever occurred to you that this kind of sloppy chain of logic, where it is ok to speculate to arrive at conclusions could be the basis for where science ends and pseudoscience starts?

How many ignorant people do you suppose will believe they have just read solid proof that an IR LED shining on the dirt will cause buried metal to vibrate? How many wasted arguments must we endure in a forum where the best minds in metal locating are supposed to be at least conversant in the basics of logic enough to show some proof that supports their conclusions?

You said you want FACTS. Yet you have been listening to speculation from Esteban as if it were facts. I have no argument against your question about why a modulated IR beam cannot experience a phase shift. My argument is Esteban is publishing misinformation to collect his glory. His FM receiver is not exactly or even remotely the same as the acoustic apparatus he posted. My argument is it is highly unlikely that an IR LED will cause a buried metal item 10 feet away to begin vibrating to cause a phase shift in an FM broadcast receiver. My second argument is I have yet to see any evidence that there is a phase shift. How does Esteban know the phase has shifted?

My challenge to Esteban is to show real proof that the phase shifts in his FM receiver when he shines his IR LED in the direction of buried treasure. Real proof comes in the form of graphs that are charted by electronic equipment that measure phase shifts. I doubt there is any phase shift. But I may be wrong, so show me.

Also show me some proof buried metal is vibrating when you shine your IR LED on the dirt above it. This is simple to do. Put your sample metal in a glass jar with a microphone attached to listen inside and bury it with 8 cm of dirt on top of it. Then record the sounds that come when you shine the IR led at the dirt.

I am anxious to see these two things. I don't believe the buried metal begins vibrating, nor do I believe your FM receiver is seeing a phase shift. If the sound is changing on your FM receiver, I think it is a change of wave-shape which is commonly referred to as "voice" or "envelope" in audio terms. This is not caused by RF phase shift. Prove me wrong!

Best wishes,
J_P

[WM6]

I would like to hear FACTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The FACT is that Esteban with his electronically intentional decorated dowsing rods is never found or granules precious metals (other than those buried by himself) in his life and it never will. This is well known FACT, except for the blind LRL believers.

For smart guys is that FACT enough, but for the greedy, there is a penalty in the form of mineoro nad such expensive worthless boxes.

[Fred]

"but then i wonder what we can do if the soil only contain gold particles and NO nuggets/coins/bars"

That's a very valid question and in that case you end up with an empty hole in the ground. That equally applies to Geochemical Prospecting which happened to me several years ago. I had soil samples from several areas and this one spot had so much micron gold the test tube bubbled over and I thought EUREKA!! Upon drywashing the soil and running the cons I came up empty handed and realized I was in an area that could only be leached to get the gold out but boy howdy it is a very pregnant spot!

Randy

Of course this is one of the ways to get 100% positive results, empty hole being in fact potentially filled by particles.

[quote=Esteban;102858]

If you don´t progress, you regress...Nothing personal Esteban, just about facts.]
Who said I'm in regression? You? Facts? I have 1,000!

Progress would mean you discover what (effect) you are detecting and how.Until then you will be just guessing. Like someone discovering fire but unable to make it.

[Esteban]

Progress: I don't need helium or other mechanical disposition, this is also progress.

Glory: Here I can't obtain, nobody can't obtain here, even in the most important forum of MD on the world. Just I wish to explain that many things made of other in the past, today is "discovered", this is, re-discovered with implementation of modern equipment. Do you see the great quantity of old information I've been posted about devices that exist in the past under other denomination and constructed with old and simple materials?

I want obtain more with minus, this is the reason why I use simple apparatus like radio, etc. In other words: as I can't complicate the thinks for to be more creditable, appears as bogus. Respectable people demmand many complicated formulas wich make more creditable the theme, sometimes a form of lying elegantly.

Maybe I'm wrong. But... prove it!

[Astrodetect]

Ok lets get things straight here. Esteban has posted a very large quantity of data that he obtained with his research all these years. We are very grateful for this wealth of information from you Esteban.Thanks you very much.
Now about the radio, we all know that the FM radio has a demodulator for FM and this is the best circuit to demodulate the frequency differences in a modulated signal, either RF or IR or US. Now, on the other hand he is insisting that the frequency shifts when you are in the vicinity of a long time buried metal. So why dont you focus on this and build some circuits and test them to see for yourself???

[Esteban]

I am a skeptic about what Esteban posted. But I am not skeptical the question you asked.

My argument is with the words Esteban posted, not what you are asking to prove.
What Esteban posted was a page showing a metal sample in an acoustic isolated container that had a microphone attached to listen for vibrating sounds it makes when a pulsed IR light beam shines on it.

We all read what Esteban posted:

"... is the phase shift.

Exactly as I made with a FM radio since more than 20 years ago! So, IR can be used for electronic LRL."

The fact is it is not exactly the same. It is not even similar. Esteban comes here with the intent to collect his glory as a great experimenter and innovator, which he is. But he distributes misinformation in order to collect his glory. This is the Geotech forum, the most highly respected technical metal locating forum in the world. And it is wrong to use false information to prove you are a glorious innovator. The result is there are readers all over the world believing Esteban's buried gold targets are vibrating under the ground causing RF phase shift, when he has performed no testing to verify there is any vibration happening in his buried target metals. He is publishing his declaration of "Exactly as I made with a FM radio since more than 20 years ago" based on pure speculation.

The fact is Esteban does not know whether his buried targets are vibrating or not. He has not made a single test in all his years to measure any acoustic vibrations as shown in the paper he posted. All he knows is his FM radio sound changes when he shines his detector at a place where he says there is a buried treasure. The proof is easy to make, but he has not done it.

And now you are asking skeptics to explain with scientific facts why an IR modulated beam CANNOT shift its frequency and phase when its in the presence of an electromagnetic field of a buried metal. Nobody here said that can't be done. What I said is the acoustic waves we see in the paper Esteban posted are not the same as what Esteban did with an FM radio since more than 20 years ago. There is a big difference between listening to acoustic sounds of a vibrating chunk of metal, and listening to a variation in a sound from an FM radio that has it's RF altered.

One thing Esteban didn't explain is the sound variation he heard from the FM radio was never verified to be caused by a phase shift. The truth is that Esteban does not know what causes the change in the sound. Maybe it was caused by a phase shift, or maybe it was caused by a second frequency interfering, or maybe some kind of modulation on the carrier. But Esteban has no clue what electronic fluctuation causes the audio change. Can Esteban supply some way to demonstrate that there was a indeed phase shift in the signal received on his FM radio? ... Or is this more speculation that he is assuming must be true because he concluded the buried metal started vibrating?

Has it ever occurred to you that this kind of sloppy chain of logic, where it is ok to speculate to arrive at conclusions could be the basis for where science ends and pseudoscience starts?

How many ignorant people do you suppose will believe they have just read solid proof that an IR LED shining on the dirt will cause buried metal to vibrate? How many wasted arguments must we endure in a forum where the best minds in metal locating are supposed to be at least conversant in the basics of logic enough to show some proof that supports their conclusions?

You said you want FACTS. Yet you have been listening to speculation from Esteban as if it were facts. I have no argument against your question about why a modulated IR beam cannot experience a phase shift. My argument is Esteban is publishing misinformation to collect his glory. His FM receiver is not exactly or even remotely the same as the acoustic apparatus he posted. My argument is it is highly unlikely that an IR LED will cause a buried metal item 10 feet away to begin vibrating to cause a phase shift in an FM broadcast receiver. My second argument is I have yet to see any evidence that there is a phase shift. How does Esteban know the phase has shifted?

My challenge to Esteban is to show real proof that the phase shifts in his FM receiver when he shines his IR LED in the direction of buried treasure. Real proof comes in the form of graphs that are charted by electronic equipment that measure phase shifts. I doubt there is any phase shift. But I may be wrong, so show me.

Also show me some proof buried metal is vibrating when you shine your IR LED on the dirt above it. This is simple to do. Put your sample metal in a glass jar with a microphone attached to listen inside and bury it with 8 cm of dirt on top of it. Then record the sounds that come when you shine the IR led at the dirt.

I am anxious to see these two things. I don't believe the buried metal begins vibrating, nor do I believe your FM receiver is seeing a phase shift. If the sound is changing on your FM receiver, I think it is a change of wave-shape which is commonly referred to as "voice" or "envelope" in audio terms. This is not caused by RF phase shift. Prove me wrong!

Best wishes,
J_P

I will go further:
For to be sure that buried metal vibrates (atomic or molecular, yes vibrates, all scientists know this), AND CAN BE DETECTED AT DISTANCE, I construct a deviced based on Xtal. I supossed that Xtal. will be affected by the "signature" of each metal. I have some buried gold in house. I discover wich Xtal. is the correct for gold (of course, the Xtal. can be in harmonic) because the non-correct Xtals. did not detect well. This demmand changes and changes. When I obtain the correct Xtal. I found a gold chain in my patio that confirm me the relations of the molecular (or atomic) vibration and Xtal. Of course, I speculate about this possibility and obtain results. Also I detect other gold items, include a coin. A big bronze item (part of old riffle) buried 130 years (battlefield) only give a short beep due the size. Bronze buttons with part with gold also was detected.

I don't pretend measure temperature with IR, for example, only detect metals with it. This was making hundred times. Of course, I'll film some day all it. Maybe my speculations about molecular or atomic vibration is not correct, but results was obtained.