Whites supporting LRL fraud?

[Infamy]

This is an example of what is wrong with your approach to allowing LRL promotion on this site.

The forum for LRL fraud is Remote Sensing, which is a scientifically proven discipline. By attaching a fraud to Remote Sensing it is given a status it does not deserve, eg (Scientology a religious body with no basis in science) To muddy the waters even further, if this is coupled to users that are not native English speakers very soon what is intended to expose LRL fraud becomes an LRL promotional tool, a trap of unintended consequences.

If you are going to keep LRL fraud on this site I suggest it is put in a place just for LRL fraud eg 'LRL Myths Forum'.
secondly the evidence you have collected and written up Carl be given 'sticky' status so people are fully aware of what they are getting into.

[Qiaozhi]

... secondly the evidence you have collected and written up Carl be given 'sticky' status so people are fully aware of what they are getting into.

It's here -> http://www.geotech1.com/cgi-bin/page...&file=main.dat

Or perhaps you missed it?

[goldfinder]

I like LRL forum

Personally, I'm a very vocal skeptic of LRLs. I've spent a ton of money buying them and exposing the scams, and even been sued for my efforts. Yet I still allow people -- even proponents -- to discuss them on my web site. Have you ever wondered why?

- Carl

I am quite happy with Carl's LRL forum. There is nothing bad about discussing a potentially very useful discovery if someone came up with a real working LRL that is duplicatable and does in fact detect beyond the range of current metal detectors.

To me trying to invent an LRL is a scientific endeavor. Science aims to discover how the universe functions. Many of science's theories have gone by the wayside in the past when new discoveries invalidated wrong theories. So despite the fact that current science says an LRL is not feasible, is a non sequitur, the quest is worth the effort.

Goldfinder

[thepest]

I'm sorry.... but..... there is a thing in this country of Americans that speak good and not so good english.... It is consistantly disrepsected and ridiculed by other's....Especially from other country's.... It's the 1ST Amendment of our Constitution... and it garunteees everyone a right of say.... no matter where they're from.... no matter how out of whack others think their opinions are.... If You Are Insulted By Freedom Of Speach???? Don't Listen.... It Ai'nt Rockett Science.... You Can Tell By My Spullin How Well Edumacated I Am...... I Ai'nt Talkin Nun Too Good English Neither.

[WM6]

I'm sorry.... but..... there is a thing in this country of Americans that speak good and not so good english.... It is consistantly disrepsected and ridiculed by other's....Especially from other country's.... It's the 1ST Amendment of our Constitution... and it garunteees everyone a right of say.... no matter where they're from.... no matter how out of whack others think their opinions are.... If You Are Insulted By Freedom Of Speach???? Don't Listen.... It Ai'nt Rockett Science.... You Can Tell By My Spullin How Well Edumacated I Am...... I Ai'nt Talkin Nun Too Good English Neither.

In priciple you are right.
But all is relative and Freedom Of Speach too.
If you dont believe, then try to defend publicly Al-Qaeda and you will see how Freedom Of Speach practically work in USA.
I think that goal of LRL scam intolerances is to protect Human Rights and not to exclusive protect only Freedom Of Speach.
One Human Rights are limited by Human Rights of other people.

[thepest]

@-----> WM6 : it is my opinion..... that you're comparing apples and oranges..... but..... i respect your right to say so.....
if someone wants to spend the 2 bits on a permit....to stand on a soap box...... and talk to an empty house..... it's they're right..... it does'nt mean we're listening or suportin them..... it just means they got the right to do it....
leaving this forum up.... is the right thing to do.... anyone who has taken a seriouse look at this thing.... has backed clean off it.... you shut it down... and it all goes underground.....then the allure is more powerfull....
this way.... it's in the light.... and expossed for what it is..... wether you beleive or not is on the beholder.....
can we quit all this and have beer now

[J_Player]

@-----> WM6 : it is my opinion..... that you're comparing apples and oranges..... but..... i respect your right to say so.....
if someone wants to spend the 2 bits on a permit....to stand on a soap box...... and talk to an empty house..... it's they're right..... it does'nt mean we're listening or suportin them..... it just means they got the right to do it....
leaving this forum up.... is the right thing to do.... anyone who has taken a seriouse look at this thing.... has backed clean off it.... you shut it down... and it all goes underground.....then the allure is more powerfull....
this way.... it's in the light.... and expossed for what it is..... wether you beleive or not is on the beholder.....
can we quit all this and have beer now

Funny thing about rights... Everybody thinks they are entitled to rights. But the fact is the only rights we have are those which are granted by a governing body.
Different countries grant different rights to their subjects, and different forums grant different rights to their members.

We are lucky the Remote Sensing forum is not one of those forums where only certain classes of people are permitted to join, and only certain opinions are permitted.
There are a lot of those around which only allow viewpoints to be posted that are approved by the forum administrators.
But Geotech allows full freedom of expression for any discussion that someone wants to bring to the table.
Is there a better way to get to the heart of an issue?
Suppose someone brought the topic of beer to the table, for example... ain't it time?


J_P

[WM6]

Can all sorts of threats to Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms to be protected by Freedom of Speech and/or Human Rights?

Can speech against Freedom of Speech to be protected by Freedom of Speech?

Can public solicitations to criminal acts to be protected by Freedom of Speech?

Where can we put here LRL scam criminals, false LRL scam propaganda, and LRL scam advocacy. Are all this pro or contra Human Rights and Freedoms?

[J_Player]

Can all sorts of threats to Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms to be protected by Freedom of Speech and/or Human Rights?

Can speech against Freedom of Speech to be protected by Freedom of Speech?

Can public solicitations to criminal acts to be protected by Freedom of Speech?

Where can we put here LRL scam criminals, false LRL scam propaganda, and LRL scam advocacy. Are all this pro or contra Human Rights and Freedoms?

"Can all sorts of threats to Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms to be protected by Freedom of Speech and/or Human Rights"?

Of course they can be protected by freedom of speech.
Why should anyone be forced to keep their mouth closed when they want to tell other people what is on their mind?
You don't like what they are saying?
Then this is YOUR PROBLEM.

So how can you deal with someone who says things you don't like to hear?
Should you ban them?
Or should you send ninja assassins to remove them?

Hahahaaa.
A lot of people tried those methods before, and they discovered that they don't work.
when you try to remove people who want to say things you don't want to hear, then everyone sees you to be the Nazi gestapo who will not tolerate anything except what you want to hear.
And they stop listening to you.
Then they listen to the people who you want to remove.
This makes a second problem for you...
Now you must also stop the people from listening as well as stopping people from talking about things that you don't want them to say.

Some people like to live in an environment of censorship.
It is the wonderful place where people are not permitted to say anything you don't want them to say.
This is a great way to promote your favorite ideas, and to stop all ideas that you don't like.
You can put people in prison when they say things that are not popular, and books are burned if they have stories of wrong thinking.
It is the wonderful land where only right thinking is allowed.
The only problem is .... who is in charge to decide what is right thinking and what is wrong thinking.

Will it be the Christian god who in charge to decide about right and wrong thinking?
Or the Muslim God?
Or Buddha?
Or maybe the Genghis Khan?
Or maybe Hitler?
Or maybe you should be in charge to decide what is right thinking and wrong thinking?

Wasn't it a wonderful time during the French and Spanish inquisitions when people were executed for wrong thinking and wrong talk?
Take a look back and see how right the censors were during those times.
It seems to me not many people even remember what wrong things were said and done back then.
Do you think the wrong ideas people had back then are still wrong ideas today?

Have we forgot that those people who were censored centuries ago were thinking the their thoughts even when they were not allowed to talk about them publicly?
They had ideas in their head that were prohibited to be thought about...!
And today, nothing is changed.
Any ideas that someone tries to censor will still be thought and will continue to propagate among the people who like these banned ideas.
The question becomes... who will be the king who decides what ideas are good and bad?
Who decides what is right thinking and wrong thinking?

In metal detecting, the only ideas I have seen anyone try to ban is dowsing and long range locating.
So suppose we try to ban both of these ideas.
First, it is an offensive gesture against anyone who wants to investigate these ideas to see if they have any value.
Second, it is impossible to stop people from thinking about dowsing and LRLs.
Third, there is no purpose to stop people from thinking about and investigating these ideas.

What is the worst that can happen when a person investigates dowsing and LRLs?
Suppose a person investigates and decides they are good working science.
Maybe they don't have the intellect to understand that fake bomb detectors fail to protect people from dying in war zones.
And maybe they are not smart enough to notice they have not found any treasure with using their LRL.

...Who cares?
We are looking at a very few persons who are interested in LRL stuff.
These are people who can become poor if they spend enough money for fake treasure hunting locators.
How can it possibly hurt you if a handful of hobbyists spend their money or their time to play with treasure detectors?
The fact is it does not hurt you.

The only people who are being hurt are people who are forced to use fake bomb detectors to keep themselves safe in a war zone.
This has nothing to do with treasure hunters and hobbyists.
This has everything to do with government corruption and fraud.
It happens because government officials are willing to lie to the people who they are supposed to protect in order to get rich from the manufacturers of fake bomb detectors.
It happens because the corrupt people who force citizens to use these fake bomb detectors are confident that there will be no free forums where citizens can read the warnings for fake bomb detectors.

If you read the Geotech forum, you will find we are one of the most vocal places on the internet that warns against the fake bomb detectors as well as fake treasure detectors.
If people were not permitted to make claims that they have magic treasure finders and bomb finders, then Geotech engineers would have nothing to complain about, and no warnings to make.
A condition of censorship will not help to prevent people from dying from fake bomb detectors. Nor would it help to prevent people from buying fake treasure detectors.
A condition of censorship will close one of the only places people can read to learn the truth about fake detectors.

We already see the forums that do not permit LRL talk... these forums do no good for warning people.
The only people who visit these forums are people who are interested in conventional metal detecting.... not people who want to know the facts about LRLs.
Only Geotech and Tnet do much of a job to warn people of the dangers.
If Geotech was to decide to ban all LRL posts, then all the warnings would end.
Nobody would come here to read the reports of whether an LRL works or not, because they would know there is no information here for current LRL events, and no news for the latest scams to watch out for.

Presently, nearly half of the Geotech readers are reading the Remote Sensing forum.
This is nearly the amount of readers we find in all the technical forums put together.
What other place on the internet has this much readership where people can read warnings about fake scam locators?

The reason why people come here to read Geotech is because they know this is the premier forum for technical based evaluations of all sorts of metal detecting technology.
They know Geotech is ready for all people who claim to have a new technology, and the facts will be quickly separated from the fiction here.
If the people who promote fake scam locators were banned, then readers would stop reading here because they would see us as a slanted forum that only permits our own point of view and bans wrong ideas that we don't like.

That is the bottom line.
Geotech can only make fraud warnings if it is a free and open forum where people can say what is on their mind, whether we like their ideas or not.
The proof is in the whining we hear from LRL manufacturers who demand that we stop publishing bad opinions about their equipment.

There is no threat from hobbyists experimenting with their VLF LRLs and dowsing rods.
The problem to be dealt with is the manufacturer of LRLs who sell fake detectors to ignorant treasure hunters, or who bribe government officials to pay high prices for their fake bomb detectors.

Best wishes,
J_P