New gold detector!!!

[J_Player]

Hi iconos-md,

I am happy to see your nice advertisement it the free advertising section. I will be waiting anxiously to read the reports you show to answer Carl's request.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Max]

Hi iconos-md,

I am happy to see your nice advertisement it the free advertising section. I will be waiting anxiously to read the reports you show to answer Carl's request.

Best wishes,
J_P

Hi JP,
Last hope ?

Yes , I wanna see too... some new ions.
I like ionic explainations... are better than SUDOKU !

Kind regards,
Max

[iconos-md]

Scientific facts, iconos-md

Answer to Carl and others request about
Scientific facts
Between any two points on the surface of the earth, there generally exists a difference in electrical potential, commonly measured in volts (or, millivolts). There are two natural 'grounds' (natural sources that can absorb or supply more charge than humans can generate). One is the ionosphere, where ionized gasses conduct electricity, and the other is the earth (hence, the origin of the term "ground"), where ions in soil moisture and ground water conduct electricity. There exists a tremendous potential difference between these grounds, a difference maintained by the atmosphere (an insulator). Because the air is not a perfect insulator, a slight electrical current slowly flows through the air, resulting in a near-surface gradient of several hundred volts/meter. There are three basic geophysical phenomena associated with Long range Metal detection.
Firstly, Spontaneous Potential. This phenomenon is a natural north-south flow of electrical current, driven by the dynamics of the ionosphere, and generates what we call TELLURIC electrical currents. Since the earth is a good (but not a perfect) conductor, Ohm's Law implies a pattern of potential differences due to this current between buried objects and the surrounding soil.
Secondly, Electrochemical potential can be generated by the ground battery phenomenon of metals in contact with a uniform soil, or, from metals in contact with ground water. This effect results in anomalies above the ground - interesting variations of electrostatic and ionic fields in an otherwise dull, uninteresting earth atmosphere. It is such variations, or anomalies, that we seek which form around buried GOLD and other noble metals after many years. The resulting chemical reaction makes the Gold act much like a large battery. By detecting these anomalies we can find buried metals from large distances.
A third mechanism responsible for natural voltage differences around buried metals is the streaming potential. Flowing water strips electrons from the metal and a potential difference occurs with the surrounding area. In areas of significant topographic relief, there is often an SP pattern highly correlated with elevation (water generally flows downhill, even underground). Water flowing toward a cone of depression can also cause an SP anomaly. SP has been used to map geothermal fluid circulation in The Geysers field north of San Francisco, California. ( Also SP has been used to map fractures carrying water under dams).
So using the above scientific facts we confirm, that long time buried metals and especially noble metals like Gold, form an electrostatic and ionic field anomaly around them, in the immediate vicinity of the object, and above the ground also which extends many meters away from the object (Electrochemical potential). The intensity and radius of this emanating electrostatic ionic field increases with time. The buried object must be buried at least 15 years, in order to form an electrostatic ionic field, and it reaches maximum intensity after 40 years. So in practice the buried metal forms the ground battery and ions migrate from it’s surface to the surrounding minerals in the soil (read above Electrochemical potential )In this case the electrolyte is the soil itself. The more the soil is moist, so much faster the phenomenon appears. This same phenomenon has been proved with conventional metal detectors also, in a small scale. Freshly buried objects are detected, only when the disk is directly over the target. However when the object has been buried for many years, then the detector signals it’s presence from a larger distance and it can detect it deeper than the freshly buried object.

Thank you
The iconos Team

[J_Player]

Hi iconos-md,

Thank you for your description of science. This sounds very similar to my description of science I made in "some considerations". Very good to hear your ideas how science works.

The problem is you did not answer our questions. I already know the science you talk about. What I asked is not the description of science. I asked to see a demonstration of your locator finding treasure. Can you provide some demonstration of your locator finding treasure?

Also, you did not answer Carl's questions. He asked 2 questions:

1. I would like to see published science articles that support this claim.
2. I would like to see verifiable reports of treasure found by professionals (i.e.,
published archaeologists) using this device.

This means Carl wants you to show some publications made by accredited scientists who say this electrostatic and ionic field develops around gold. He is also asking for reports from accredited professionals like archaeologists who publish their findings and are using the Iconos locator.

I am sure you have these reports from accredited professionals available. Carl is only waiting to see you show them.

Best wishes,
J_P

[iconos-md]

Scientific facts, iconos-md

Hello Jplayer
It seems there is a misunderstanding.I already gave you the science behind the electric field anomalies around buried metals.These facts are from scientists worldwide who publish this biography.It is another matter about how we detect these fields with the iconos-md.That is the secret part of the matter and it will never be published.I dont understand your confusion since these methods are already proven and are used in geoexploration to detect electric field anomalies from buried metals from long distances.( you say This means Carl wants you to show some publications made by accredited scientists who say this electrostatic and ionic field develops around gold)
I just did.
Secondly you want a demonstration.
Do you know where the long time buried gold is in order to test our units?
I think not.So how will we demonstrate this unit on your terms? This cannot be tested in the Lab but only in the field.So if you want to test it we will be happy to sell you our unit any time you want it.Then you will see for yourself if it works.
Thank you
The iconos Team.

[J_Player]

Hi iconos-md,

We have no misunderstanding. We did not ask for you to repeat the science you told. We did not ask to know the method how your Iconos locator works.

Carl asked you to provide the published science articles that support the science of ions and static fields forming on buried gold, and to provide reports of published archaeologists who use the Iconos locator finding treasure.

1. You did not provide any published science articles for us to read. Where are these published science articles you are referring to? This is what Carl asked for. He wants you to tell him how he can read the scientific report you said was published that explains the ionic and static fields. He does not want to read your explanation of this science, he wants to read the reports the scientist published.

2. You did not provide any verified reports of treasure found by published archaeologists using the Iconos locator. Carl asked you to provide this report so he can read it the same as you did, not read your talk about it.

You only repeated your idea of the science. You did not tell us how we can read the published reports by scientists that verify this same science.

You are wrong. I do know where long-time buried gold is. I know for absolute fact several gold ore deposits, many hundreds of thousands of years buried. I can get permission from the owners of the land to make a survey with the Iconos to locate the known gold deposits, and they will recover enough of the gold to see if your detector finds it.

I also know many cemeteries where there is definite long time buried gold more than 100 years in contact with the soil. I know the exact location of some of these long-time gold jewelry items within 1 meter accuracy. This is very easy to test if a long range detector can find this gold.

I will be happy to make tests to prove the Iconos will detect these sources of long-time buried gold. You can send me a PM for shipping instructions if you want me to test the Iconos for you. But maybe easier if you test from your location. If you don't want to demonstrate the Iconos, I don't mind. I will be happy to only read the reports you will show for the published archaeologists using the Iconos to find treasure.

We are all waiting to see the reports you said were published by scientists that support the formation of ions and static fields on long time buried gold, and reports published by archaeologists who found treasure with the Iconos locator.

Best wishes,
J_P

[J_Player]

.

[Rudy]

Answer to Carl and others request about
Scientific facts
Between any two points on the surface of the earth, there generally exists a difference in electrical potential, commonly measured in volts (or, millivolts). There are two natural 'grounds' (natural sources that can absorb or supply more charge than humans can generate). One is the ionosphere, where ionized gasses conduct electricity, and the other is the earth (hence, the origin of the term "ground"), where ions in soil moisture and ground water conduct electricity. There exists a tremendous potential difference between these grounds, a difference maintained by the atmosphere (an insulator). Because the air is not a perfect insulator, a slight electrical current slowly flows through the air, resulting in a near-surface gradient of several hundred volts/meter. There are three basic geophysical phenomena associated with Long range Metal detection.
Firstly, Spontaneous Potential. This phenomenon is a natural north-south flow of electrical current, driven by the dynamics of the ionosphere, and generates what we call TELLURIC electrical currents. Since the earth is a good (but not a perfect) conductor, Ohm's Law implies a pattern of potential differences due to this current between buried objects and the surrounding soil.
Secondly, Electrochemical potential can be generated by the ground battery phenomenon of metals in contact with a uniform soil, or, from metals in contact with ground water. This effect results in anomalies above the ground - interesting variations of electrostatic and ionic fields in an otherwise dull, uninteresting earth atmosphere. It is such variations, or anomalies, that we seek which form around buried GOLD and other noble metals after many years. The resulting chemical reaction makes the Gold act much like a large battery. By detecting these anomalies we can find buried metals from large distances.
A third mechanism responsible for natural voltage differences around buried metals is the streaming potential. Flowing water strips electrons from the metal and a potential difference occurs with the surrounding area. In areas of significant topographic relief, there is often an SP pattern highly correlated with elevation (water generally flows downhill, even underground). Water flowing toward a cone of depression can also cause an SP anomaly. SP has been used to map geothermal fluid circulation in The Geysers field north of San Francisco, California. ( Also SP has been used to map fractures carrying water under dams).
So using the above scientific facts we confirm, that long time buried metals and especially noble metals like Gold, form an electrostatic and ionic field anomaly around them, in the immediate vicinity of the object, and above the ground also which extends many meters away from the object (Electrochemical potential). The intensity and radius of this emanating electrostatic ionic field increases with time. The buried object must be buried at least 15 years, in order to form an electrostatic ionic field, and it reaches maximum intensity after 40 years. So in practice the buried metal forms the ground battery and ions migrate from it’s surface to the surrounding minerals in the soil (read above Electrochemical potential )In this case the electrolyte is the soil itself. The more the soil is moist, so much faster the phenomenon appears. This same phenomenon has been proved with conventional metal detectors also, in a small scale. Freshly buried objects are detected, only when the disk is directly over the target. However when the object has been buried for many years, then the detector signals it’s presence from a larger distance and it can detect it deeper than the freshly buried object.

Thank you
The iconos Team

Why is this electric field formed only by gold or other noble metals? Seems to me that other, more electrically active and more plentiful metals (e.g. Zinc) would create even stronger ionic fields. If these non-noble metals also give rise to these fields, how does one go about discriminating between them, since in either case, these fields are quasi-static or DC in nature.

[J_Player]

Hi Rudy,

The answer to your question of how the Iconos discriminates gold is given on their web page: http://www.iconos-md.eu/

Our detectors are the first in the world to be able to detect buried metals without using ground electrodes but can detect the spontaneous potential and electrochemical potential phenomena due to our revolutionary Gold sensor. They also discriminate the phenomena associated only with long time buried Gold from large distances. Thus you can scan large open areas in a small period of time and be sure to find the treasure.!!!!!

The method of discriminating is the Iconos revolutionary gold sensor. This is their trade secret, so we cannot expect them to reveal their secret method.

Your inference that traces of metal ions from zinc would be stronger than traces of gold ions seems reasonable to me. I have read reports where lakes were poisoned by dissolved zinc compounds leaching from the soil, but never a report of gold ions concentrated to the amount where it could poison a lake. I believe any faint trace of gold ions would be millions of times less than dissolved zinc.

With respect to trade secrets, Carl did not ask to know Iconos method to locate treasure, but he did ask to see some reports from published scientists who describe this ionic and electrostatic fields that Iconos says exist around long time buried gold. We are still waiting to see the scientists reports so we can read them. We are also waiting to read the reports Carl asked for to read about published archaeologists who used the Iconos to locate treasures.

Best wishes,
J_P

[Carl-NC]

Yes, I would like to see actual published papers that support the claimed methods. This is a task easily done for induction metal detectors, magnetometry, sonar, radar, induced polarization, resistivity, quadrupole resonance, infrared, etc. But it seems impossible for LRL.

I would also like to know if someone in the USA has bought an Iconos locator. I will gladly arrange a visit, do some testing on both fresh and long-time buried gold, and report my findings, whatever they may be.

- Carl

[Seden]

$7,238.60USD and no proof?!

Iconos,

I think you take the men on this forum for fools,but we have heard time and time again these same claims with no scientific proofs. Especially when you say the method is "secret".
For me to blindly shell out $7,238.60USD is beyond crazy.
Please don't joke with us making claims without independant test data.
I also very much like Carl's idea of meeting a person in the USA who owns a unit so he can see it for himself. Ok, I live in the Los Angeles area,is there a person I can contact?

How about Southern California, I'd be more than happy to drive to San Diego or Santa Barbara to see a demonstration,no problem.

Randy

[J_Player]

Hi iconos-md,

Please forgive doubting skeptics. We know your long range locator really works. We are only waiting for you to provide the information from published scientists who agree that there are ionic and static fields produced around long time buried gold, and to read reports published by archaeologists who found treasure with the Iconos.

I for one will be happy to take video movies of your Iconos finding buried treasure. I will also drive to San Diego or Santa Barbara or anywhere in between or 1000 kilometers distance from either of those Southern California locations. I can make accurate videos that show the true results of the Iconos finding treasure because I am not predisposed to believe the Iconos is incapable of finding anything. You can count on me to help you prove the Iconos is a true treasure finding machine when there is a test performed so I can capture on video.

Yes, $7,238.60USD is a lot of money to pay for a treasure machine. But if it works, then this is only a small bit compared to the millions of USD it will find in treasure. I am sure you will sell thousands of Iconos treasure locators after we see a demonstration of them finding long-time buried treasures. If you want some free advertising, then you may ship an Iconos Treasure finding machine to Seden, and I will make video movies of it finding long time buried gold for no cost to you. After I photograph Seden finding these long time buried treasures, then we will ship the Iconos back to you so you can sell it to a customer as a proven treasure finder.

But that's not all.... I will put up a professional web page showing the videos of the Iconos finding treasure that you can use for advertising the Iconos. This will be absolute proof it works from and independent tester and photographer. Nobody will be able to make any argument against the facts and the videos.

Best wishes,
J_P

[J_Player]

.

[J_Player]

Hi iconos-md,

We have been waiting for you to show us where we can read publications made by scientists that explain the ionic and electrostatic fields from long-time buried gold. We have been waiting for you to show us where we can read the reports made by published archaeologists who found treasure with the Iconos locator. But you have not shown us any source where we can read what these scientists published.

Also, I received no reply for my offer to provide free testing of the Iconos locator. And I read another person who lives closer to you also offered to pay all expenses for you to test the Iconos in Italy, and he says you refused to allow any testing where there are known long-time buried metals:

...iconos they are in contact with them and I have offered him to come in itali everything paid to make a will its metal but unfortunately they have refused, in my parts I know varied places where during the war they have hidden treasures but the points they are approximate and as I do to find them? whoever wants to come to find me and it possesses a metal that is able' to rouse them does me him to know
sorry for my english but i write with programm

Is this true? Do you refuse to conduct any test to demonstrate how well the Iconos will find long-time buried metal?

Maybe I am asking too soon. Perhaps you are already making arrangements to accept the free testing with expenses paid to demonstrate the Iconos finding known long-time buried treasures in Italy.
Is this correct?
Are you preparing to make a demonstration?
Will you show where we can read the reports made by scientists soon?

Best wishes,
J_P

[Max]

End of the truce

Hi iconos-md,

Please forgive doubting skeptics. We know your long range locator really works. We are only waiting for you to provide the information from published scientists who agree that there are ionic and static fields produced around long time buried gold, and to read reports published by archaeologists who found treasure with the Iconos.

I for one will be happy to take video movies of your Iconos finding buried treasure. I will also drive to San Diego or Santa Barbara or anywhere in between or 1000 kilometers distance from either of those Southern California locations. I can make accurate videos that show the true results of the Iconos finding treasure because I am not predisposed to believe the Iconos is incapable of finding anything. You can count on me to help you prove the Iconos is a true treasure finding machine when there is a test performed so I can capture on video.

Yes, $7,238.60USD is a lot of money to pay for a treasure machine. But if it works, then this is only a small bit compared to the millions of USD it will find in treasure. I am sure you will sell thousands of Iconos treasure locators after we see a demonstration of them finding long-time buried treasures. If you want some free advertising, then you may ship an Iconos Treasure finding machine to Seden, and I will make video movies of it finding long time buried gold for no cost to you. After I photograph Seden finding these long time buried treasures, then we will ship the Iconos back to you so you can sell it to a customer as a proven treasure finder.

But that's not all.... I will put up a professional web page showing the videos of the Iconos finding treasure that you can use for advertising the Iconos. This will be absolute proof it works from and independent tester and photographer. Nobody will be able to make any argument against the facts and the videos.

Best wishes,
J_P

Hi,
"We know your long range locator really works. "

Who are "We" ?

I know that is just another that claim his LRL work. No big news.

So this:
"We know your long range locator really works. "
IS PURE DISINFORMATION.

Or not ?

Kind regards,
Max