some cosiderations

[Esteban]

Detection in coils and antennas or loops (electronic LRL) occurs by the spontaneous potential causes by conductive bodies. Is all you need to know.

You can read more here:

http://www.wellog.com/surface_sp.htm

And here:

[Rudy]

Detection in coils and antennas or loops (electronic LRL) occurs by the spontaneous potential causes by conductive bodies. Is all you need to know.

You can read more here:

http://www.wellog.com/surface_sp.htm

And here:

That is very interesting Esteban. But how does a coil or loop detect a DC potential, or a DC electric field of 1 Volt/Kilometer ?

Clearly running through the country side waving the loop up and down swiftly to cause it to sense this field does not sound too practical.

[Max]

Max, for you, halo is good for MD, and also you believe in it. If good for MD, why don't for electronic LRL? You need more than googles. But your case have not solution.

Hi Esteban,
I still think you have a clue on many things e.g. BFO... and don't wanna be too polemic here but some of your posts are an insult to intelligence.

You wrote now :

"If good for MD, why don't for electronic LRL? "

So you make think people here that HALO could be good for LRL as in MD.. but using a question so actually say nothing.

But you wrote before in the HALO thread the following.

Seems you contradice yourself that way.

So is HALO good or not for LRL ? I still don't understand.
(Cannot find any usefulness of all this disinformation)

Best regards,
Max

[Max]

Hi max,

You are confused. I have no argument against or for esteban. YOU are the one arguing about his circuits. When I read he compares you to people who don't believe the earth is round, then it makes me believe he thinks you belong here: http://www.alaska.net/~clund/e_djublonskopf/Flatearthsociety.htm

If you think esteban's idea is wrong, maybe you should argue with him. I have no argument. I only laugh when I see something looks funny to me.

Best wishes,
J_P

Hi,
oh yeah... laugh as you want! Is a good thing !

But you cannot explain these !

Infrared+ FM radio ??? 7 meters.
IR + FM radio + magnetic absorption antenna = 25 m.

Do you ?

So I laugh of both of you.

Oh yeah... sorry... you're not belonging to him... and have not arguments

Kind regards,
Max

[J_Player]

Let's all vote for whether a halo is good or not...

******** VOTE NOW ********

1. is halo real or fake idea? Halo is REAL/FAKE
2. Is halo good for metal detectors? Good/bad for metal detector
3. Is halo good for long range locators? Good/bad for LRL

Post your votes below so we can use democracy to decide if halo works!

Best wishes,
J_P

[J_Player]

My vote:

1. Halo is real
2. Halo is good for metal detectors
3. Halo is good for LRL

Best wishes,
J_P

[Max]

My vote:

1. Halo is real
2. Halo is good for metal detectors
3. Halo is good for LRL

Best wishes,
J_P

Hi,

1. for me, is real, but can't explain who it works, have no proofs, just ideas
2. yes when it comes from good targets (not iron), could make easier finding a target with an MD

3. is a problem... cause you have to find a working LRL first to say if halo could be good or not in searching for treasures: nobody untill now proved that LRL work... e.g. with a public demonstration, so I think that the question have no meaning untill someone show us a real working LRL and also the physics involved... if could be related to halo or not.

Kind regards,
Max

[J_Player]

No need to prove anything. This is only a vote, not a science class. You vote for what you want the halo law to be.

So far we have:

2 votes for halo is real
2 votes for halo works for metal detector
1 vote for halo works for LRL

Everybody vote so we can use democracy to find out if halo works!

Best wishes,
J_P

[Esteban]

1. Halo is real
2. Halo is good for metal detectors
3. Halo is good for LRL
And for electronic LRL.

[Esteban]

But how does a coil or loop detect a DC potential, or a DC electric field of 1 Volt/Kilometer ?

You walk with the device, you're a kind of electrode and when find a different potential, this glitch the detector, because concentrate metal is more strong than disperssed minerals or ores. Coils are working in AC. You must to move the detector slow. Each DC really is AC, since you put and quit the search coil during detection (movement), is a kind of "knock".

No need to plant an electrode 1 km away. For me, spontaneous potential of solid metal as a coin is very more than 1 V in the first impulse. But this occurs with items buried for long time.

[Rudy]

But how does a coil or loop detect a DC potential, or a DC electric field of 1 Volt/Kilometer ?

You walk with the device, you're a kind of electrode and when find a different potential, this glitch the detector, because concentrate metal is more strong than disperssed minerals or ores. Coils are working in AC. You must to move the detector slow. Each DC really is AC, since you put and quit the search coil during detection (movement), is a kind of "knock".

No need to plant an electrode 1 km away. For me, spontaneous potential of solid metal as a coin is very more than 1 V in the first impulse. But this occurs with items buried for long time.

Ok, if I understand you correctly, you walk at a normal pace, so fast motion of the coil through some quasi-static flux lines is not necessary.

I further understood from your above, that what you are really detecting is the transition from a region of normal "background" mineralization, to a region of concentrated metal. Moving the coil so it goes from sensing one region to the other creates the "glitch" in the coil that you sense and that is why you think of it as AC.

Did I understand right?

[Esteban]

Did I understand right?

Yes, is right. You must go through the phenomenom, because can't be reproduced in electronic labo (I can't). Good sites for to try is battlefields, always there are in these places conductive old items.

Because you're moving in different terrains, regions, atmospheric pressure, soil, etc., detector must be have external controls for to adjust in the best point.

Deppend of the sensibility (with stability) of the instrument, primary input circuit, you can discovery how strong can be a bronze bullett shield, for example, at 5-6 m, because expand the "signal" in an angle of 120º, also OVER the object, causes you can't centrate very well. You go out of this field, and "activity" stops. But this work with antennas, no coils.

[Seden]

Very clear now Esteban

Esteban,

Yur last posts-most clear explanations you've ever given about your system. Anyone who doesn't understand that doesn't need to know.
What you have described is EXACTLY the same way motion detectors work. Gotta move the coil or you will not hear the target-period.

So you mentioned that you do not use a coil but an E-field antenna which for this application would be the best as that's what you're after.

That being said I would imagine to detect spontanious Polarization or a difference in potential of a target would make it more a medium range detector. Very interesting though and I'd like to build one. Thank you for taking the time to make it perfectly clear to us all. I wasn't sure of what you were doing and was set to go off in another direction.

Very good Esteban, keep up the good work.

Randy

[Esteban]

Hello Randy

As the phenomenom is complex (but is electric and/or magnetic and also maybe re-radiate RF of different sources), the ways of detection also are severals.

Deppend of input circuit, telescopic antenna is very precisse and for more long detection.

[Rudy]

Did I understand right?

Yes, is right. You must go through the phenomenom, because can't be reproduced in electronic labo (I can't). Good sites for to try is battlefields, always there are in these places conductive old items.

Because you're moving in different terrains, regions, atmospheric pressure, soil, etc., detector must be have external controls for to adjust in the best point.

Deppend of the sensibility (with stability) of the instrument, primary input circuit, you can discovery how strong can be a bronze bullett shield, for example, at 5-6 m, because expand the "signal" in an angle of 120º, also OVER the object, causes you can't centrate very well. You go out of this field, and "activity" stops. But this work with antennas, no coils.

Thank you Esteban.

Yes, a coil would not be the best receptor for this.

A thought occurs to me that might improve the sensitivity of the apparatus.

A differential front end preamp might do a better job of cancelling the first order and some of the second order noise. Each input of the differential amp would be fed from a different (but identical) antenna element and the two antennas are held perpendicular to each other.